Hi! I'm new to Moodle and not tech-savvy but have been successful so far in building a brand new website. I have read the "before you post" post and looked for answers before posting. I registered my domain on name cheap last week but just learned on your post that Softaculous is frowned upon. As I said, I have no clue about anything, but have found the website building process very easy and intuitive so far. Until I decided to add Moodle to the mix.
I downloaded the 4.1.4 version because the latest one wasn't available with my Stellar hosting plan so I tried again choosing the second available version and it worked. When I clicked on the link (screenshot attached), and opened the website on a different browser, all the pages I had created on my website disappeared and there was a generic Moodle page instead. Luckily I was able to go back and publish my website again. Does that mean Moodle is a page builder? I'm not familiar with it at all, I just want students to be able to click on one tab on my site to access learning resources without overriding everything else I've built.
The 'frown upon' for Softac installs is that Softac is commercial and 'close source'. No one in these forums can look under the hood to see what it does/how it does it ... only the results. And, from what you said happened (lost your main site (built with a 'page builder'), I'd say Softac messed up. Softac should have installed moodle in a subdirectory of your 'page built site'.
Because it is closed source and commercial, we forum users can only attempt to 'reverse engineer' what Softac did (or didn't do) to see if it's really following requirements for a moodle. Official Moodle docs:
With a 'page builder' site, think those are really true web pages interlinked via some graphical interface via your server. Moodle, on the other hand, is a 'dynamic application' - run by PHP + php extensions required to run the moodle, with a database backend (usually MySQL/MariaDB) for the moodle application.
So to get support for a Softac mess up, there is a link to Softac Support in the upper right hand corner of the softac screen. Might go there and see what they say!
This is not to say you couldn't install moodle manually, but you'd have to be familiar with 'techie server things'. 
'SoS', Ken
Thank you so much, Ken! It looks like this ease of use is deceptive because now I'm running into problems I don't know how to fix. I don't know what any of these terms mean and hope their customer service can help. I really appreciate your taking the time to help!
With one of these hosting arrangements, it's probably simple to create a website and simple to create a Moodle site. But to have both in a meaningful way is dependent on how the hosting is organised and how they intended this hosting to be used.
My guess is that it's a one or the other kind of thing.
As I'm sure you're realising, beyond a certain point you need to acquire some basic server admin skills to be in a position to work around these things (*not* a developer as is often said). None of this is rocket science and should be readily achievable if you have the time and patience.
My guess is that it's a one or the other kind of thing.
As I'm sure you're realising, beyond a certain point you need to acquire some basic server admin skills to be in a position to work around these things (*not* a developer as is often said). None of this is rocket science and should be readily achievable if you have the time and patience.
Yes! Thank you for your encouragement, Howard. I'm interested in learning when I'm not so busy creating content for an upcoming class. Any learning resource recommendations?
"...busy creating content for an upcoming class."
So how/what are you using to do above? Page Builder?
Learning Resources for Moodle ... are plenty, but ... there is always a 'but' ... much depends upon hosting environment. You've mentioned "Stellar hosting plan".
Can you provide some info about that plan? How much space, how much memory, that sort of techie/server stuff ... which you can see in cPanel's right column.
Hosting providers themselves might have customer FAQ's and Docs (how 2's).
We know server is capable of installing 4.1 of Moodle or Softac would not have had that in it's menu.
You do have all the tools in your cPanel to install a moodle - but they aren't all in one place (that's Softac). A file browser, a multiPHP tool [allows you to choose what PHP version to run with a site(s) - might be called 'EasyApache' - a misnomer really!], a MySQL Tool for creating DB's and another for setting up MySQL/DB users - credentials.
Trouble with providing a 1-2-3 easy to follow Moodle doc is hosting ... they are not all the same ... similar ... but not exactly the same. Thus a moodle doc/tutorial can't be specific to where/how you are hosted and if you see a doc like that you still might have to adjust what you read to your hosting environment.
Does your cPanel have a Terminal icon? Does your cPanel have a Git icon?
Are you completely adverse to 'command line'?
Will say this also ... it's not your 'success quotient' that matters here ... it's your 'failure quotient' - and you've already expressed (to an extent) you desire to succeed!
It's a journey ... but well worth taking, IMHO!
'SoS', Ken
Thanks, Ken!
My goal is to have one page on my website with short mini lessons/activities. Some would be open for anyone to use, others would require an account and password. That's where my students would have additional practice. I wonder if Moodle would be the right tool for that.
Thank you for bringing all this to my attention. I had to look up many of these terms to begin to understand your questions and make sense of the info on my cPanel. I picked the Stellar hosting plan because it was the cheapest and I thought it'd be enough for a beginner with a brand new, low traffic website. Here is some info I found about my plan, that I hope is relevant: 20 GB SSD, 256.9 MB bandwidth, 1 GB physical memory, 1,024 IOPS, 50 MB I/O.
I don't think my cPanel has a Terminal icon. I looked for it and also googled it but it wasn't under the "advanced" tab. I did see a "Git Version Control" icon, though. I'm not familiar with command line yet, but if that knowledge is a necessary component to succeed, I will learn.
Thank you for the helpful advice and encouragement! I'm definitely excited about this learning journey!
My goal is to have one page on my website with short mini lessons/activities. Some would be open for anyone to use, others would require an account and password. That's where my students would have additional practice. I wonder if Moodle would be the right tool for that.
Thank you for bringing all this to my attention. I had to look up many of these terms to begin to understand your questions and make sense of the info on my cPanel. I picked the Stellar hosting plan because it was the cheapest and I thought it'd be enough for a beginner with a brand new, low traffic website. Here is some info I found about my plan, that I hope is relevant: 20 GB SSD, 256.9 MB bandwidth, 1 GB physical memory, 1,024 IOPS, 50 MB I/O.
I don't think my cPanel has a Terminal icon. I looked for it and also googled it but it wasn't under the "advanced" tab. I did see a "Git Version Control" icon, though. I'm not familiar with command line yet, but if that knowledge is a necessary component to succeed, I will learn.
Thank you for the helpful advice and encouragement! I'm definitely excited about this learning journey!
Me thinks your Stellar plan is underpowered for a Moodle.
one ends up trying to do more with it, until limited resources of server
reach their maxes.
https://docs.moodle.org/401/en/Installing_Moodle#Hardware
In the link above:
"Disk space: 200MB for the Moodle code, plus as much as you need to store content. 5GB is probably a realistic minimum."
You have "20 GB SSD" .. 200MB code would fit, but the 'lions share' of space will be
what's in your moodledata directory. 5GB sounds like a lot, but think, once you see
Minimums are never enough ... 8GB is more like it. Notice it says 'plus'. I, personally, don't think that 8GB is for a large production server ... more like 16GB or even 32GB! But that would depend upon number of students AND what you are doing with the moodle (too much to describe here).
No Terminal means low end - shared server - other customers on the same server.
Cheapest might have been fine for a 'page builder' site, but
as one gets into a moodle, one will see what it does, and one ends up trying to do more with it, until limited resources of server
reach their maxes.
https://docs.moodle.org/401/en/Installing_Moodle#Hardware
In the link above:
"Disk space: 200MB for the Moodle code, plus as much as you need to store content. 5GB is probably a realistic minimum."
You have "20 GB SSD" .. 200MB code would fit, but the 'lions share' of space will be
what's in your moodledata directory. 5GB sounds like a lot, but think, once you see
what you could do with a moodle, you'll fill up that 5GB. Let's not forget, after building a course in moodle, you would want to make a site backup - that's an archive of the code directory, an archive of moodledata, and a DB mysqldump.
How much of that "20 GB SSD" space is used right now? How much free space?
That info you should see in cPanel - right column.
Then there is memory ...
"Memory: 512MB (min), 1GB or more is recommended. 8GB plus is likely on a large production server"
Minimums are never enough ... 8GB is more like it. Notice it says 'plus'. I, personally, don't think that 8GB is for a large production server ... more like 16GB or even 32GB! But that would depend upon number of students AND what you are doing with the moodle (too much to describe here).
No Terminal means low end - shared server - other customers on the same server.
Git icon, means that git command line would be available to you f
So think your first order of business is to find out what your provider can do to move your account to a plan where you have more space and more memory.
Yes, that will cost more ... period!
In cPanel of the upgraded plan, Terminal icon is a big plus (maybe not right now, but it will be). Even if you don't use it, if you allow others to support you, Terminal would be what many would ask access to.
And, the Softac response about putting moodle in a subdirectory ... is one way ... but if one had an .htaccess file for page builder, that could affect moodle in a subdirectory. To be honest, me thinks putting moodle in a subdomain of site (which means directories completely away from your page builder site) would be the best/safest way never to mix the 2.
My 2 cents, of course!
Also, it might be time for you to seek if provider has tutorials/how2's for customers.
'SoS', Ken
Thanks, Ken.
Right now the disk usage is 540.91 MB / 20 GB (2.64%). Yes, it's a shared server. I'm hoping I can start small as I figure out how things work, then I can upgrade. Are teachers spending so much money on hosting? Maybe if I can figure out how to monetize my educational resources that could be an option in the future.
Right now the disk usage is 540.91 MB / 20 GB (2.64%). Yes, it's a shared server. I'm hoping I can start small as I figure out how things work, then I can upgrade. Are teachers spending so much money on hosting? Maybe if I can figure out how to monetize my educational resources that could be an option in the future.
Hi,
I am from the Softaculous team.
If you want to run your main site and Moodle side by side you need to install Moodle in a sub directory. For this on the Moodle install page in Softaculous you have "In Directory" field in which you can enter any directory name e.g. "classes", "moodle" or anything you wish and you will be able to install and access Moodle along with your main site present.
It seems you left that field blank leading to install Moodle in the main directory of your site. However if you do this Softaculous will ask for a confirmation that do you want to overwrite the existing files. Only if you select this option Softaculous will overwrite your existing files/folders.
If you have any questions with Softaculous feel free to open a support ticket with us directly.
I am from the Softaculous team.
If you want to run your main site and Moodle side by side you need to install Moodle in a sub directory. For this on the Moodle install page in Softaculous you have "In Directory" field in which you can enter any directory name e.g. "classes", "moodle" or anything you wish and you will be able to install and access Moodle along with your main site present.
It seems you left that field blank leading to install Moodle in the main directory of your site. However if you do this Softaculous will ask for a confirmation that do you want to overwrite the existing files. Only if you select this option Softaculous will overwrite your existing files/folders.
If you have any questions with Softaculous feel free to open a support ticket with us directly.
Thank you, Brijesh! I will delete it then and try again with the correct settings once I figure out how directories and subdirectories work.
Ok, Brijesh ... a question for ya ... and I am asking for the OP, not myself!
OP did indeed *not* tell installer to install in a subdirectory - so that was OP's error. But then install failed due to versions of MySQL/PHP available for a 'cheapo' hosting package.
Yet, in the interface for 'Current Installations' it's listed ... OP shared a screen shot of that. In the listing there is a 'trash can' icon. If ... IF ... OP clicks that, what happens?
Obviously one will/should think it will erase moodle code but does Softac erase 'surgically' or does it use a global *?
Would be important for OP to know for OP doesn't want to loose what has been built with 'page builder'!
Granted ... you could 'dodge' answering here and point to your own support forums for the customer to get commercial assistance ... but wonder if you could see your way by that and respond here.
'SoS', Ken
For the OP as well as anyone who comes across this thread in future.
We do not do a global * delete.
When you install any app via Softaculous in document root (i.e. without sub-directory) of primary domain or addon/sub-domain Softaculous will remove only the files associated with that app (in this case Moodle). So if you have any other file/folder that you uploaded manually that will not be deleted.
However if you have uploaded new files e.g. you installed WordPress in document root and it is common files e.g. index.php then when you remove Moodle it will remove the index.php file because that is in the Moodle files list.
If you would like to just remove the installation from Softaculous records without removing files/database please use the following guide :
https://www.softaculous.com/docs/enduser/how-to-remove-installation-without-deleting-files/
If you install an application in a sub-directory Softaculous will delete the complete sub-directory e.g. domain.com/moodle Softaculous will delete the moodle folder.
Hope this clears everything.
We do not do a global * delete.
When you install any app via Softaculous in document root (i.e. without sub-directory) of primary domain or addon/sub-domain Softaculous will remove only the files associated with that app (in this case Moodle). So if you have any other file/folder that you uploaded manually that will not be deleted.
However if you have uploaded new files e.g. you installed WordPress in document root and it is common files e.g. index.php then when you remove Moodle it will remove the index.php file because that is in the Moodle files list.
If you would like to just remove the installation from Softaculous records without removing files/database please use the following guide :
https://www.softaculous.com/docs/enduser/how-to-remove-installation-without-deleting-files/
If you install an application in a sub-directory Softaculous will delete the complete sub-directory e.g. domain.com/moodle Softaculous will delete the moodle folder.
Hope this clears everything.
Thanks for replying and providing Softac docs link. Will be/would be helpful to OP's. BTW, heard back from OP and am informed that hosting provider assisted OP in 'cloning' the site/instance.
On low end hosting, there are limits to inodes. Cloning as a method of backup or keeping failed upgrades/installs, could lead to other issues which would only force the OP to upgrade hosting ... which, of course, cost more and might be beyond OP's desire to pay. So there's a 'catch 22'.
IMHO, what's really needed for first time OP's exploring the use of Moodle, is a pre-install/discovery app - easily installed, that would report things like PHP version + extensions, DB version, etc. *prior to attempt to install*.
Granted, there is an environment check in moodle which is done just prior to install but that is done after the code is there. And it doesn't go into limitations of hosting ... like inode limits, etc.
Even though coders strive for it, nothing is 'perfect' and in-foulable yet! :|
On the other side, first time OP's would need to be able to install that pre-pre-environment check and interpret what information is provided.
My 2 cents, of course!
'SoS', Ken