Comparisons and advocacy

Google LMS

 
moi!!! it is what is is...
Google LMS
Documentation writersParticularly helpful Moodlers

Apparently,  Google is demonstrating their new LMS in Australia today.  Anyone know anything about it?  All comments would be greatly appreciated. 

 
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Picture of john Simpson
Re: Google LMS
 

To me the popularity of Moodle is that it is purely open source. Google isn't, and I am suspicious on what they are really up to.

 I'm going to guess that it is going to be comparatively easier to install, and they may well have the LMS incorporated with a good  easy  online video conference classroom with whiteboard. 

but for me, I think I have had enough just learning about installing and operating in moodle, and I have no desire to start all over again with another LMS.

 
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Just wondering . . .
Re: Google LMS
Particularly helpful Moodlers

This crosses my email today:

http://www.course-director.dk/en/

I quote: 'CourseDirector makes your classroom in the cloud more engaging, more collaborative, and more effective for everyone'

Using google apps

-Derek

 
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Picture of dawn alderson
Re: Google LMS
 

re:

http://www.course-director.dk/en/

Absolutely no surprises here:

Key words-selling points:

'The student can'  'The Student view'

The Student is what we have designed this for!

Something moodle is reaching for at the mo-let us be honest.

Time, Timing now a key factor...the time is right to shift the focus.

my tenpence worth.

Dawn

 
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moi!!! it is what is is...
Re: Google LMS
Documentation writersParticularly helpful Moodlers

All very interesting, if brief comments, but the reality is that as I work in a state system, the state has just sent out a memo to the effect that tools such as Google Apps are not to be used by students.... The argument is that Google is targeting students for add campaigns... (like how long ago did that come out?) Unfortunately, this also means that students are receiving invites to adult services. Good on ya Google...  

 
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Just wondering . . .
Re: Google LMS
Particularly helpful Moodlers

Scores of schools in NZ use Google, with some sort of sign up option, and bad ads don 't get sent.

I can find out more if you like.

-Derek

 
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Picture of Marcus Green
Re: Google LMS
Core developersParticularly helpful MoodlersPlugin developersTesters

"Scores of schools in NZ use Google, with some sort of sign up option, and bad ads don 't get sent."

Are you confident of that?

 
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Picture of dawn alderson
Re: Google LMS
 

I wish to exapnd on this-going to find the time.....

Soon

cheers all,

Dawn

 
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Picture of dawn alderson
Re: Google LMS
 

Hey,

Question for all.

Do you think that there is anything stopping Google from making parts of their empire open-source?

Yes? why?

No? Why?

My view....it will happen.

D

 
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Picture of Marcus Green
Re: Google LMS
Core developersParticularly helpful MoodlersPlugin developersTesters

It depends what you mean. They make massive use of open source and Free software, some gets made publicly available. However they tend not to release software that would allow others to reproduce their business model, as there is no advantage in supplying an advantage to competitors. Is there a question behind your question?

 
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Picture of dawn alderson
Re: Google LMS
 

Hi Marcus,

yes, apols not clear there. I was thinking about John's post at the time:

'To me the popularity of Moodle is that it is purely open source. Google isn't'

and when you say:

They [Google] make massive use of open source and Free software, some gets made publicly available.

My question is why shouldn't they expand with such events? I think they will.

Reason: releasing software doesn't necessarily mean releasing one's business model, as such models evolve....so for example releasing code like the open source model is one thing, but releasing code for subscription (so closing the gap-to some degree) is of course another...that is something along the lines of what I think might happen....and the ads will stay I think- too sad  Could be wrong of course.   

D

 
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Picture of Marcus Green
Re: Google LMS
Core developersParticularly helpful MoodlersPlugin developersTesters

Well yes, and no. In my experience the issue with releasing software is not the releasing but the maintaining. 

So for example many years ago I created an entire Quiz engine, with marking and everything. I never released it because it was very much for internal use only and would have been very hard to maintain and upgrade. 

Since then I have created a question type plugin for Moodle. A big chunk of that work was ensuring it fitted with the Moodle way of doing things and the writing of unit tests and following up bug reports.

Having said all that, Google has what is effectively a limitless amount of money for software maintenance so it might not apply. (By contrast I dont smile )


 
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Just wondering . . .
Re: Google LMS
Particularly helpful Moodlers

Done some research Marcus.

No ads at all.

This makes NO other comment about the ethics or otherwise of Google, datamining, privacy etc.  But in my research rave reviews about ease of use, spam filtering and functionality, 

-Derek

 
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Picture of Marcus Green
Re: Google LMS
Core developersParticularly helpful MoodlersPlugin developersTesters

Derek, I wasn't wondering about Google services that don't show ads. I would be amazed if a Google service promoted as not showing ads showed ads. I was questioning the idea of a Google service that didn't show "bad" ads.  

Partly this was because of different people's idea of bad and partly because with an almost entirely automated system you can be confident that some people would mis-categorise whatever they were selling.

Bit of a disclaimer, I have been using Gmail since 2005 and I receive a tiny trickle of money from Google ads that appear on on my various web sites. About enough for nice meal out and a taxi home once or twice a year.

 
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moi!!! it is what is is...
Re: Google LMS
Documentation writersParticularly helpful Moodlers

Yes, I have had similar from other sources, with the same reservations. I must admit I am impressed with the interconnectivity of all the tools so far. It is this argument that I find most compelling, and seriously suggest that Moodle, Wikimedia, WordPress and Mahara look at common coding and ease of SSO. If they all a common, integrated, product line that would be able to compete, that would make it really easy. 

I once considered trying it myself but realised I did not have the PHP skills or time to learn the right skills or the aps themselves,  to be able to do it. However, someone who has experience, and with a number of other similarly experienced people, should be able to get a workable product out there relatively quickly, I would imagine. 

That way, I suggest, these products will survive into a new generation of computing.   

 
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Picture of Marcus Green
Re: Google LMS
Core developersParticularly helpful MoodlersPlugin developersTesters

Ease of SSO is clearly desirable, but I have been learning quite a bit about it recently and because of the many different ways of doing it it is inherently complex. I'm not quite sure what you mean by common coding. If you mean using similar PHP internally or the same libraries (i.e lets get those other tools to adopt Pear/QuickForms/YUI smile), then that is not going to happen any time soon. If you mean items like common configuration and interface ideas, then I'd vote for that.

In the last few versions Moodle has moved towards improving it's "pluggability", which seems like a very good idea to me.


 
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moi!!! it is what is is...
Re: Google LMS
Documentation writersParticularly helpful Moodlers

What elements does each app have in common? Identify them and develop a common database and code for those things. This will be, perhaps, not a simple thing, but every app has a login process, identity and authentication tables, they all have an installation process, they all have some type of skin. These are common elements, peripherals though, outside of app-critical, but each will be structured differently. Redevelop so all use the same common elements - not simple, but not impossible. Keep the app-critical code, just change the peripherals. 

And, for me, it is this that will make all these products desirable acquisitions, what other product offers this kind of flexibility, apart from Google? That is, I suspect, what they have done, built a product, then built another using the existing elements they both require and so on until you have an entire, fully integrated, system made up of whatever tools you want to use. Add a Chromebook and the rest of us are in trouble. Want to use a different app, no problem, click on it to access it. Want to create a new tool, you do not have to spend time creating a login process, a skin process, id and authentication processes, they are already there, just develop the app-critical code and plug in the other bits or plug it into the other bits, either way. That is what Moodle could do, if MD thinks it necessary, and I would suggest it is now.

 
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moi!!! it is what is is...
Re: Google LMS
Documentation writersParticularly helpful Moodlers

Yes Derek, if you wouldn't mind. I am going to be meeting with one of the people who makes these decisions in the next month or so, so any information I can use that will overturn it will be most welcome. My only ploy at the moment is that if we cannot access those tools online, then schools will have to build network servers that carry similar tools, and are externally accessible, This will cost a great deal of money and I am hoping the budgetary response will be that either the funds are made available or the decision is reversed. My bet will be that they will reverse eventually, but I will need a lot of information to be able to justify that. However, having said that, Oz is now in the process of abandoning a FTTH system and implementing a FTTN broadband system, you know, the one NZ and England are both now abandoning in favour of a FTTH broadband system. We do things in reverse here, you know, if it is a good idea, we have to do the opposite.... 

 
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