Can quiz questions analyze lab data?

Can quiz questions analyze lab data?

by Peter Halverson -
Number of replies: 10

Hi all,I want to use Moodle as a way for students to analyze lab data.

I mean that I want the student to enter information that he/she measured and also a conclusion based on that data.  Moodle would then determine is the analysis was done correctly.

Example:  Car's speed lab.

Student enters distance traveled D and time taken t.  He also enters what he thinks the speed v was.

Moodle starts with the student's D and t, and if the "correct" v (which would be D/t) agrees with the student's v, then its good, full credit.

Can this be done??? 

Another way of looking at it is that right now, we have various ways for questions to start with randomly chosen numbers.  But this would replace the random number with a student inputted number.

Again, can it be done?

(I did ask this question a couple months ago but there was no answer...  I'm asking again now because our spring break is next week and I'll a little time to work on it.)

Thank you,

Peter Halverson

 

 

 

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In reply to Peter Halverson

Re: Can quiz questions analyze lab data?

by Tim Hunt -
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This is not possible with any of the standard Moodle question types.

It would be possible with STACK.

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In reply to Tim Hunt

Re: Can quiz questions analyze lab data?

by Peter Halverson -

Good Morning,  Following Tim Hunt's suggestion I have installed the STACK question type.  Its very cool.  It brings the ability to create complex math questions, includes graphing (yes!!!), and it can intelligently parse the equations that the students create.   Following up on my previous question...  I would like for the student to input a few numbers from his/her physics lab into the question.  (e.g. moving object's location x1 at time t1 and location x2 at time t2.)  Then the student inputs his conclusion.  (The object's average velocity is ___.)  Then the STACK question would determine whether the student did the math OK.

    So......  Now how can I approach this using STACK?  Would it involve a multipart STACK question?

Sincerely,

Peter Halverson

PS:  FYI for random readers, the STACK question depends on Maxima, an intelligent symbolic math program.  Its very powerful and worth showing to the students.  (Especially wxmaxima, with the nice graphical interface.)  But a drawback is that it is using a lot of CPU.  To get stack to work reasonably fast, I had to disable "instant verification" and increase the STACK timeout from 5 seconds to at least 15s.  (I have it set to 30 s now.)

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In reply to Peter Halverson

Re: Can quiz questions analyze lab data?

by Joshua Bragg -

I had the same problem with speed at first.  Have you followed the directions here:  https://github.com/maths/moodle-qtype_stack/blob/master/doc/en/CAS/Optimising_Maxima.md

I'm really interested in doing this also but haven't had the time to sit down to try it.  I did something somewhat similar with balancing reactions.  My goal was to allow all of the infinite possibilities when balancing a reaction. I've attached one of the questions so you can see how I did it.

By the way, if someone has an easier suggestion on how to make that balancing question work I'd love to see it.

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In reply to Peter Halverson

Re: Can quiz questions analyze lab data?

by Peter Halverson -

I did it!  (Sort of). Looks like you *CAN* do lab data analysis with STACK.  I'm attaching this question in moodle XML format.   (Moodle 2.4.9)  ---Halverson

 

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In reply to Peter Halverson

Re: Can quiz questions analyze lab data?

by dawn alderson -

OK. Thanks all.  Stretching the brain a bit a here....honestly-yes have done some coding before, long time ago-doesn't really count though... feels a bit ancient smile

Yet, it does seem you are saying-one can code up in stack.........for analysis purposes-Yes?  Now, I like the attachments- really helpful, generous even-and readable.   

New stuff allowed in stack-within own moodle site...and add-ons in place=way to go then? Yes?

Very curious here.

And don't be thinking you can examine me on this-I was 17/18 years old at the time of learning that stuff!!!! wink

Are you saying... STACK can offer a platform for experimentation...for data collection and/or analysis

ta

Dawn 

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In reply to dawn alderson

Re: Can quiz questions analyze lab data?

by Peter Halverson -

Hello...   Just to clarify the purpose of my original post.

As a California high school physics and chemistry teacher with 180 students and no adult help, the logistics of doing anything, particularly labs is daunting.  Imagine grading 180 lab reports of varying levels of messiness, from unreadable to readable but logically unstructured.

My hope is that Moodle could at least guide the students through calculations based on the data that the students acquired.

It could also prompt the students into writing a more structured report.

Moodle could even help the students forge ahead with error analysis.

Potential result:  I have have less grading drudgery AND the students have a better learning experience from the lab.

---Peter H.

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In reply to Peter Halverson

Re: Can quiz questions analyze lab data?

by dawn alderson -

Peter, helpful thanks.

I am trying to imagine...and create in my head smile a way to be innovative in relation to data collection...for research projects........so, smiling here...because I think I may venture-one day-cool  into the world of Visual basic.......now I can hear peeps laughing....but I want to create a bespoke tool.......anyway.....I cannot remember much about Python......and Java.......crumbs.......maybe when I am retired and have the time!

Going to keep on thinking hard about this, really helpful thread though.

Cheers,

Dawn   

 

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In reply to Peter Halverson

Re: Can quiz questions analyze lab data?

by Christopher Sangwin -
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Peter,

This is a very interesting use of STACK which I didn't anticipate when I wrote the question type. I'm happy to help you get this working, and am sorry I didn't spot this thread earlier (I don't routinely follow the quiz forum).

I've updated the question.

I changed question level simplify to "false", this will stop STACK from automatically changing the student's answer from 1+1 to 2, for example. I also think absolute tolerance with numbers of 0.01 makes more sense here than a relative tolerance.

There are two properties you are looking for in the answer to the third part.
(1) it is equivalent to d/t using the numerical test for accuracy
(2) it entered as a single number - I've used Maxima's predicate function numberp(ex) to establish this.

Since these are separate properties, I've added a second node to the potential response tree to check each separately.

Note that numberp "Returns true if expr is a literal integer, rational number, floating point number, or bigfloat, otherwise false." So, numberp(5.0/3.1) is false, because this is the ratio of two floats. numberp(50/31) is true.....

If you really want a float here, you should use the predicate floatnump. But, this will not work if you have 5 (an integer) instead of 5.0 (an equivalent float). So, if you want to avoid this problem, you need to use "floatnump(ex) or integerp(ex)". This will be true if you have a float or integer, but not a rational.

I've also made the input to ans1 reject any answer containing "/" as invalid. This makes it impossible for students to enter a division (the most likely thing they will do) and won't generate any penalties for this in the scoring mechanism (if you choose to use this). There are docs on this feature, but for me this makes most sense in this case. Doing this, also means we don't have the problem with the rational 4/5 for the answer when you really wanted the student to *calculate* this to be 0.8 for example.....

Yes, there are lots of options, but there is a mind set to STACK and I hope you persevere and make some progress. I'm happy to help.

I've added a third node which checks if the student's answer is equivalent to the reciprocal of the correct answer. This is a common mistake, and one I'd like to add feedback to.

I've also added some "question tests" to the question. You can see these on the top right of the try page. This feature is for question quality control.

I agree STACK is resource hungry, and I've tried my best to address this issue. Optimize maxima and turn the cache on. Avoid timed exams with a hard end time which encourage large groups of students to simultaneously submit large quizzes. I shouldn't need to issue this warning, but that is the reality. Sorry!

Please let me know how you get on.

Chris

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In reply to Peter Halverson

Re: Can quiz questions analyze lab data?

by Doug Moody -

Hi Peter,

I am a S.T.E.M teacher, and we have what I call an "Electronic Design Journal" This is journaling, and I do allow free flow of their thoughts. However, I also require them to copy and paste information in there that I require. Things such as formulas, words, definitions, etc.

But as far as measured data, you will have to constrain the possible choices to have any hope of having a machine analyze the possibilities. You can do this with several of Moodle's quiz types, but you could also create a database and the student will have to put in their own data into that database, and then you could run the data through a process that pulls out the "right" answers. This would appear to them as inputting data into a notebook, but it would really be an ongoing test, with the analysis of it near the end of a unit (done by you)

There are many ways to go here, but you might have to break some of your own paradigms about teaching. I believe that tests ought to be learning opportunities, not just end-of-game assessments to find out what students retained in their short term memories. Instead, I allow students to take tests over and over until they get it right. This repetition is sometimes what makes them learn. That applies also to some tests which I require 100% mastery, or they won't be allowed to go further. An example of that is a lab safety test, in which they have to score 100%. I tell them that I won't settle for 90% safety! They get mad at me sometimes, but they get over it, and they learn.

I too have lots of students and its only me (I have 230 middle school kids) They are all in a blended environment, with Moodle at the center of it all, integrated into activities in the classroom and lab.

Good luck. There is no handbook on how to do this, just your own best imagination. Don't fear to think outside the box!

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