Recommendation on VPS spec

Recommendation on VPS spec

by Melissa Benson -
Number of replies: 26

Hi all, a simple question..I currently run a Moodle 1.9 site for teacher professional development. We have 50 courses (not all active) and have less than 100 people active and enrolled and taking courses at a time. We are going to upgrade Moodle (new install, not actually upgrade). We are currently on a shared server: Power plan here.

We're upgrading to Moodle 2 and I'm wondering if you guys would recommend us moving to a VPS plan. I would go to the VPS-1 one.

I'm not very knowledgeable about how shared servers work and all of that but I'm assuming this is a big step up, right?

I know that Moodle 2 need more resources and we will only get more students taking classes. We also want to do some theming work as well.

 

Do you think a VPS (lowest one) is a good way to go? It's a great time to switch because I'm installing a new Moodle and I tried installing it on our current server but had mysql, php version issues..then upgraded..then made our current site break, ugh! And support has been horrible.

Anyways...just looking for some advice or confirmation. Thanks in advance!

 

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In reply to Melissa Benson

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Usman Asar -
Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers

Melissa, Unfortunately VPS-1 would NOT be sufficient, I will tell you reasons for that.

your current shared hosting, may be sufficient for your current needs and could as well be for your oncoming needs for the reason, that on shared hosting, the hardware is typically very powerful because they host some 500+ accounts on each server and each account hosting 3+ domains , so you are expecting some 1500 sites running on a shared hosting server. because shared hosting is the basic level of most hosting types, so people tend to get shared hosting for testing purposes only, some for keeping domains only etc. A typical shared host server is made up of Multiple Core CPU (8+) and some 24GB of RAM with RAID discs, and not every customer actually USES their shared hosting accounts other than testing, or may be few light websites running, so eventually those who are actually using it gets a good share of that strong hardware deployed for shared server.

Now, coming to your VPS, comparing to a powerplan (which I am sure must be hosting way less than 500 accounts per server), the RAM of 512 is very very low, you should be looking at 3+ GB of RAM on a private server, as I have seen someone on shared hosting before, thought of getting a VPS with 768MB of RAM (which is 256 MB more than your desired one), and there moodle site fell apart after 30 concurrent users, and you are talking about 100.

 

how much is your Budget to go?

 

 

 

 

 

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In reply to Usman Asar

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Melissa Benson -

Well, my client is only paying about $11/month now. Jumping up to $30 or $40 is what we're thinking.

 

Are you saying that the VPS we would go to might perform LESS than the shared plan we are on? Wouldn't a shared plan be less RAM available to us because on a VPS our site is the only one on it?

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In reply to Melissa Benson

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Usman Asar -
Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers

Melissa, I have given you live example of someone (on this forum - i actually forgot the link to that discussion), they were on shared host, and happy with it, went up to get VPS with 768MB RAM, and all went down, eventually putting them back to shared host.

 

usually hosting companies run two types of shared hosing accounts, personal ones are for like $4-$6 and Business ones are like $14-$25, obviously giving advantage of lesser accounts per server.

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In reply to Melissa Benson

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Usman Asar -
Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers

you are right in saying that on shared host you have less RAM available ONLY IF --> there is load on the server, than every account comes to its allocated Quota, but like I said, only 20% users actually use the shared hosting accounts for there small websites rest keep it for testing and just domain parking, so if there isnt any load on server, you can expect your account to have more resources available, and expect the power out of a multi core CPU, with 24Gigs of RAM at least, and RAID configuration on discs.

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In reply to Melissa Benson

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Usman Asar -
Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers

Do have a look at http://www.stablehost.com/enterprise-hosting.php

its enterprise plan on shared host, so hosting lesser accounts, and plus side, they are on litespeed webserver, which is claimed to be 7 times faster than Apache that is currently used by almost every host, litespeed being PAID software as compared to Apache, so you can expect bang for your buck.

and I am fairly sure, their cheapest enterprise plan for $19 will be twice as strong as your VPS-1

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In reply to Melissa Benson

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Rick Jerz -
Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Testers

I recommend the VPS-3 as a minimum, which has enough RAM for moodle for your size.

I moved to a VPS around 3-4 years ago.  It takes me more time trying to manage it, but it was a good move.  My moodle is about the size that you describe for yours.

Who will be your "administrator"?  And does this administrator know something about UNIX?

 

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In reply to Rick Jerz

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Melissa Benson -

I guess I'm a little surprised. It seems like a HUGE jump to go from a shared plan costing $10/month to spending $45/month. The VPS does give me other things that are needed like the ability to upgrade and install things that I want but to run the same site (upgraded to Moodle 2) it would cost that much more? The shared plan doesn't even really tell you exactly how much RAM you get while the VPS-3 is all yours. My site runs fine on the shared one now.

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In reply to Melissa Benson

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Rick Jerz -
Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Testers

Yep, that cost difference is correct, and it is what I see across many companies' products like this.

If your shared site is running fine, then there isn't any need to move to a VPS.

If you think that you might want to move to a VPS in the future, now is a good time to just experiment a little.  With some companies, like GoDaddy, you can buy a VPS for a month.  It might be the best $30-$40 you can spend right now.  You can see if you like being the administrator of your own VPS.  After a month, cancel your account.

By the way, I have a hosted Bluehost account, just for experimenting right now.

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In reply to Rick Jerz

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Melissa Benson -

So I asked some questions in the host's forum and looked around and they told me that there is a "gap" from the shared server specs and price to the first and second tier VPS plans. This is because I am now running cpanel and the OS which takes up some of that RAM. Where in the shared environment my RAM didn't need to be spent there. He said after tier 2, when you start adding more RAM and going up that is when you get 100% of those resources allocated to your site.

I'm going to go with the VPS-2 plan for $34/month, I think. Or that's my suggestion. I don't feel comfortable installing and running Moodle 2 on a shared server and I need to switch or install Moodle 2 on a different one than the 1.9 one is running on anyways because it was a MESS with mysql and php versions working for 1.9.5 and 2. even though the shared server was "ok", Moodle 2 just has so much more robustness I think. And really, $34/month for a Moodle site running classes for professional development and credits is cheap! It's just a big jump from the $11/month ha.

 

Thanks for your feedback..anymore is welcomed as well smile

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In reply to Melissa Benson

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Rick Jerz -
Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Testers

Melissa, your plans seem fine.  Don't kill your current Moodle.  Work with your VPS and get comfortable with it.

Do you know SSH?  Do you know what FTP is?  What computer (Mac or PC) are you using.

Are you going to get cPanel with your VPS?  My personal preference is cPanel, but I am a novice at these things.

If you know SSH and how to SSH to your server, issue a "top" command to see how much memory is being consumed.  Also do this after you have moodle running.

By the way, I have 2.5.2+ running just fine on my VPS.  Soon, I will upgrade to 2.6 (working out just a few more issues).

Consider starting 2.5 (or 2.6) from scratch.  It is possible to move courses from 1.9 to 2.5/6, but read about the upgrade methods because it's a bit tricky.

Make sure that the versions of php and mySQL are correct on your VPS in order to run Moodle.  If not, well, the upgrade is part of being an "administrator."  Make sure to ask questions here on Moodle.org when you run into problems.

Yes, $34/month is relatively cheap.  For my domain, VPS, cPanel, etc., I am paying (myself) around $45US/month, which I don't mind doing for managing my own courses at my own university.  It appears that your school will pick up the cost.

When you get your VPS, look for phpMyAdmin, normally included to help you manage your mySQL databases.

When you eventually have success, you will look back and realize that it really wasn't that hard.

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In reply to Rick Jerz

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Melissa Benson -

I don't think my current plan is fine. I don't want to be in a shared environment. I have no control over php or mysql versions. And i Know Moodle 2 needs more resources. Plus, the customer service my current host provides is terrible. It's so bad it would be the sole reason I would move.

I know what SSH is smile That is one reason why I want a VPS. I'm in no way good at it (at all) but I like to try and learn. I use FTP all the time. I'm using mostly Mac. But I'm proficient in PC as well.

I have used cpanel a ton and I use cpanel/WHM with my current (personal) VPS, which I really like.

I can't currently SSH into my client's 1.9 Moodle site as it's on a shared server.

I am going to start from scratch installing 2.6. I'm going to keep my client's current 1.9 as is..don't touch it..hope it lasts a few months smile and all while, I will be installing and using Moodle 2 with new students. No upgrade, fresh install. I've done it many times.

I now what phpmyadmin is, use it every once in awhile.

Really, my questions aren't how to install, how to check for php and mysql versions, etc. I've installed countless Moodle installs (mostly in non-pressure situations smile ). It's basically if I switch to a VPS-1 or 2, will it be LESS than my current shared server? What dos Moodle 2 need? I'm hoping the knownhost vps-2 will be fine.

What host are you using for the $45/month?

This work is is actually my consulting job. I work in a k-12 school district but I also work with a friend/client running her moodle site. She will be paying the hosting costs.

....wow..my responses were very random..hope you kept up smile lol thanks for the feedback. I love the moodle community!

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In reply to Melissa Benson

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Rick Jerz -
Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Testers

Mesissa, okay, you have all of the basics.

I have a GoDaddy "Value" VPS.  Often, you can negotiate a discount (i.e., don't pay full price).  You will find many negative comments about GoDaddy here on moodle.org, but most of these are about GoDaddy's "hosted" servers.  You won't get any "Moodle" support from GoDaddy, but they seem to know their servers well.

Many other companies sell VPS's.  Some, like TMDHosting, claim to know Moodle.

I just installed Moodle 2.6 on my BlueHost "hosted" server.  It's at www.rjerz04.com/moodle26.  Bluehost also sells VPSs, but it appears that they are a little more expensive than GoDaddy.

It seems like, from your background, that you will only need minimal help.  Once again, you can often try one companies VPS for a month, and cancel if you don't like it.  The "value" GoDaddy VPS comes with 2GB RAM, which is pretty good.

I too have a Mac, and it's convenient to just use Terminal to SSH into my VPS and hosted servers.  On a VPS, you can have as many Moodle installs as you want.  I have two or three... one is for "production" and the others are for experimenting.  For example, right now I am experimenting with Moodle 2.6, before I update my production moodle.

The moodle community, I find, provides better support than anything you get with other products, like Blackboard and Desire2Learn.   I am just an individual professor, doing everything myself.  So support is very important to me.

I think that you will enjoy a VPS.

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In reply to Rick Jerz

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Usman Asar -
Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers

Rick, how is your bluehost VPS working? which package are you on?

do give a try to the CloudFlare CDN optimizer as well, as bluehost is one of the hosts that have partnered with CloudFlare to give its customers RailGun optimizer for free to bluehost customers, which otherwise costs $200 a month per site.

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In reply to Usman Asar

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Rick Jerz -
Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Testers

My Bluehost is a low end "hosted" account, and it was free to educators.  I am running one of my experimental Moodle 2.5's on it (www.rjerz04.com/moodle).  Seems to be doing well.  Soon, I will upgrade to 2.6.

I had to request SSH access, which they did with absolutely no questions at all.

No, I haven't tried CloudFlare CDN, nor do I know what it is.  I will have to check into this, and see if they provide this on their hosted account.

I do like that Bluehost provides cPanel to me, at no extra cost.

I am thinking about using Bluehost for my next semester students hosted accounts.

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In reply to Rick Jerz

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Usman Asar -
Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers

Rick, if you have to get an account just for tests, why not use mdl2.com?

they allow you make FREE moodle site, with many (if not all) themes to test, as you get your packages already installed.

also, you mentioned using VPS with bluehost, is it the VPS you are using or the shared personal accounts? even there shared personal accounts will surpass many out there. Like I said, I had been with them for 9 years, not now though, but they are absolutely recommendable.

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In reply to Usman Asar

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Rick Jerz -
Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Testers

I didn't know about mdl2.com.  This might be a good way to practice with moodle.  However, it might not help one understand how to run Moodle on their own.  Thanks for this tip.

I don't have a VPS with Bluehost, just a shared hosting account.  But I am impressed with Bluehost, and I just installed Moodle 2.6 to make sure it runs on their hosted account (it does, www.rjerz04.com/moodle26).

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In reply to Rick Jerz

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Melissa Benson -

Rick, I am the administrator. My client runs the courses and everything and I maintain the Moodle site. I know very little of linux but like to *try* and use it smile I personally have the VPS-2 which I've used as a sandbox.

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In reply to Melissa Benson

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Usman Asar -
Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers

Melissa, why not give a try to the host offering litespeed servers? its like, on same hardware, I have seen implementing litespeed web server has doubled its load bearing capacity, and its just $20 a month upgrade on most VPS plans, and some $35-40 on Dedicated.

Ask Rick how is his bluehost account going, then get their cheapest VPS-1 Plan as its still cheaper than what you had been planning on knownhost. and unlike ALL other (not even many), Bluhost is the only one that offers refund at ANYTIME of your contract should you not feel happy, I have been with them for last 9 years and not a day went by that I had a bad experience with them. Though they dont do litespeed servers, but use optimizers like I mentioned to Rick that could boost the site performance without adding costs.

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In reply to Usman Asar

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Melissa Benson -

Usman, Which host had the litespeed server? I'm not really familiar with that. Is it INSTEAD of apache? Makes me nervous, if so. It seems like if there was a #1 host that was the best..it would come up in searches and everyone would use them. I'm just a bit weary of people throwing out hosts, you never know.

 

Rick, Do you use Bluehost with a Moodle install? How is it?

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In reply to Melissa Benson

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Rick Jerz -
Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Testers

Melissa, my Bluehost is used only for experimenting with Moodle.  It is good to have some experimental moodle's to try things on.  Keep your "production" moodle working for students.

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In reply to Rick Jerz

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Melissa Benson -

Which bluehost plan do you have? Link? Okay..so there's no students on it?

 

What does youe production server look like?

 

We may be in different situations with that. I work in a school district with 10K students and I would never choose an offsite hosting company like this with 1GB of RAM! For my full time job we have a server on site with 4GB+ (I think 8GB?) But in my case it's literally 5-6 users on at a time, at the most, right now, for this other consulting job I'm doing.

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In reply to Melissa Benson

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Usman Asar -
Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers

Melissa, why not give a try to host that does MOODLE ONLY hosting, like MOODLEHOSTING.COM

they have shared, as well as dedicated plans, and have got slider/comparison as well to give you idea, how many users each account can handle.

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In reply to Melissa Benson

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Rick Jerz -
Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Testers

I have their "free" hosted plan for professors.  Nope, no students on it, so I cannot comment on how well this would work for you.  But I do have SSH and FTP with this, so for all practical purposes, it is similar to a VPS.  Well, not quite, I cannot tweak mySQL, and things on the back end of the server as I can with a VPS.

My production server looks like this.  Here are some videos that I made for my students.

 

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In reply to Melissa Benson

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Usman Asar -
Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers

Litespeed works instead of Apache, but switch is instant without any changes, you can find litespeed hosts at there site Litespeed partners You will be able to find plenty of shared and VPS/Dedicated hosts listed there who are offering Litespeed, some have litespeed as default (Like Crocweb, Stablehost) on some this is an option, as unlike Apache which comes free, litespeed is paid server so hosting companies keep it as an option to the customer.

I have heard good recommendations about CrocWeb (They have litespeed and cloudlinux), but because they offer just personal accounts, so you may would be better off with Stable hosts' enterprise class hosting starting from $19.95, they are on RAID-10 SAS discs, so no performance bottlenecks coupled with litespeed servers. it will be powerful.

you dont have to worry about the servers running at backend, as you'll be given CPanel to work with to use Moodle.

I have had used bluehost/hostmonster (same company) shared personal hosting with Moodle 1.9 in past, and it worked well. if you want to try them out, then start with there Shared PRO accounts, starting at $24 a month, and with bluehost you have ease of switching/upgrading at time as when you feel like needing it, all you have to do is tell the staff what time you want the switch, and  it will be over even before you have managed to make yourself a cup of tea.

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In reply to Melissa Benson

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Usman Asar -
Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers

or you can as well give a try to VPS from bluehost/hostmonster at http://bluehost.com/cgi/vps

I have used their shared hosting for moodle while I was teaching MBA/BBA students, and their shared hosting worked absolutely fine, its recent they put themselves into VPS/Dedicated servers as well, just consider the hardware you are getting for almost same amount you are planning to pay with knownhost @ 25/month for 512MB RAM compared to 2048MB RAM for $29, and it may even be less if you pay on annual basis.

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In reply to Melissa Benson

Re: Recommendation on VPS spec

by Visvanath Ratnaweera -
Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Translators
Hi Melissa

Looking back at the whole discussion, I notice two things:

a) The concentration on "VPS spec" as if the VPS will deliver on its own. There is an administration part, which has to be done by people.

b) The jump from 10 USD to 50 USD per month for a VPS is considered prohibitive. What is the factor if you compare the totals; VPS plus the wage for maintaining it? In case the cheaper VPS meant more trouble, what would be the new factor?
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