I have a Quizport chain of HotPot multiple-choice exercises. When I enroll as a student and complete one, Moodle will not do anything with it unless I click the correct answers for each question. It just hangs.
If I go back and click the correct choice for each wrong item, then the QuizPort completes that quiz and moves to the next action.
I thought that this had been changed under QuizPort, such that you could have as many wrong answers as the post-conditions permit.
In many cases, there are only two choices, so the feedback telling you that your choice was wrong already tells you what the right choice is.
If HotPots will continue to require that the correct answer be chosen, that is not a bad thing. It just requires a different set of directions on how to use the quizzes.
This situation occurs in my experimental "Language Skills--19" course, under AP-A, which Gordon can access.
-- Gerald Grow
In reply to Gerald Grow
Re: HotPot inside Quizport demands that all answers be correct
by Gordon Bateson -
Hi Gerald,
I logged into your site and was able to access the QuizPort called "AP-A".
I tried the first quiz which is called "AP Style, A-1". It did not behave as you describe. Rather, it behaved as you would like it to behave. Namely, questions on which I had chosen all the wrong answers, leaving one unselected correct answer were flagged as being completed.
For example, on the first question, which has two possible answers, I chose the wrong answer "airbase" and I did not select the correct answer, "air base". Then I did the other questions in a similar way. I finished the final question, a message saying "you have finished this quiz" appeared, and my results were returned to Moodle. That is what you want, is it not?
> I thought that this had been changed under QuizPort,
> such that you could have as many wrong answers
> as the post-conditions permit.
This seems wrong to me. The quiz's post conditions do not constrict, refine or affect in any way the number wrong answers on multiple choice questions in the quiz. The post-conditions relate to the final score of the quiz as a wholel. Perhaps I have misunderstood what you meant?
Gordon
I logged into your site and was able to access the QuizPort called "AP-A".
I tried the first quiz which is called "AP Style, A-1". It did not behave as you describe. Rather, it behaved as you would like it to behave. Namely, questions on which I had chosen all the wrong answers, leaving one unselected correct answer were flagged as being completed.
For example, on the first question, which has two possible answers, I chose the wrong answer "airbase" and I did not select the correct answer, "air base". Then I did the other questions in a similar way. I finished the final question, a message saying "you have finished this quiz" appeared, and my results were returned to Moodle. That is what you want, is it not?
> I thought that this had been changed under QuizPort,
> such that you could have as many wrong answers
> as the post-conditions permit.
This seems wrong to me. The quiz's post conditions do not constrict, refine or affect in any way the number wrong answers on multiple choice questions in the quiz. The post-conditions relate to the final score of the quiz as a wholel. Perhaps I have misunderstood what you meant?
Gordon
In reply to Gordon Bateson
Re: HotPot inside Quizport demands that all answers be correct
by Gerald Grow -
The problem I'm having does not happen with the 2-question "test" quizzes, but only in a "real" quiz. If you
I think you'll find that the Quizport hangs, instead of presenting the quiz to be taken again, as the post-conditions call for.
However, if you go back and click the remaining answers till you get a correct answer on each item, the quiz will advance normally to the next step in the Quizport.
Sorry to waste your time on the example that works. Try this one. I think you will be able to see the problem.
Gerald
- go to Language Skills 19,
- change to Student role,
- take AP-A (it has 11 questions) and
- get at least two of the questions wrong,
I think you'll find that the Quizport hangs, instead of presenting the quiz to be taken again, as the post-conditions call for.
However, if you go back and click the remaining answers till you get a correct answer on each item, the quiz will advance normally to the next step in the Quizport.
In using Hot Potatoes quizzes on Moodle, I have occasionally seen this same behavior (outside of Quizport), resulting in a quiz that will not record its grade until the student has clicked a correct answer for every item (except possibly the final one).
BTW, as part of my own investigation, I did validate the xhtml in the quiz above. It returned one warning about "Mismatch between Public and System identifiers in the DOCTYPE declaration." That mismatch remains, since it will probably occur in all Hot Potatoes quizzes.
Sorry to waste your time on the example that works. Try this one. I think you will be able to see the problem.
Gerald
In reply to Gerald Grow
Re: HotPot inside Quizport demands that all answers be correct
by Gordon Bateson -
> The problem I'm having does not happen with the 2-question
> "test" quizzes, but only in a "real" quiz
Same here. As I said, I was trying the A1 quiz in the AP-A QuizPort.
> I think you'll find that the Quizport hangs,
> instead of presenting the quiz to be taken again
Not for me. The results are sent and the quiz is redisplayed.
What browser are you using? Did you try any other browsers? Does this always happen or just occasionally? Try a different computer. A different building. Try clearing your browser cache. Do a force refresh (Ctrl+F5) of the page displaying the quiz. Does your browser report a javascript error when the quiz "hangs"? Can you rebuild the QuizPort on my server and get the same results? Can you put this QuizPort in a publicly accessible place on your server, so others can come and try?
Gordon
In reply to Gordon Bateson
Re: HotPot inside Quizport demands that all answers be correct
by Gerald Grow -
Very strange. The problem continues here. I'll follow your suggestions and report back.
In reply to Gerald Grow
Re: HotPot inside Quizport demands that all answers be correct
by Gerald Grow -
I have put the problem quiz on your server, in a Quizport that also contains two 2-item quizzes that work fine.
The quizzes are set to repeat if the score is less than 90%.
Please try getting less than 90% and see if each one repeats. I can get the short ones to repeat, but not the long one -- at least not when more than one question still does not indicate the correct answer.
In particular, I'm trying to answer this question:
If a student clicks an incorrect answer, is it necessary for that student to then click the CORRECT answer for that item in order for the quiz to process?
On the 2- item quizzes, an incorrect answer is accepted, and the quiz is processed and re-presented, as the post-conditions specify.
On the 11-item quiz, more than one incorrect answer seems to make the quiz hang, and nothing happens.
At least, that's how it goes on my Mac OS 10.5.8 running Firefox 3.5.2. And on Safari on the Mac. And on Explorer on a Vista machine here.
Thanks.
Gerald
The quizzes are set to repeat if the score is less than 90%.
Please try getting less than 90% and see if each one repeats. I can get the short ones to repeat, but not the long one -- at least not when more than one question still does not indicate the correct answer.
In particular, I'm trying to answer this question:
If a student clicks an incorrect answer, is it necessary for that student to then click the CORRECT answer for that item in order for the quiz to process?
On the 2- item quizzes, an incorrect answer is accepted, and the quiz is processed and re-presented, as the post-conditions specify.
On the 11-item quiz, more than one incorrect answer seems to make the quiz hang, and nothing happens.
At least, that's how it goes on my Mac OS 10.5.8 running Firefox 3.5.2. And on Safari on the Mac. And on Explorer on a Vista machine here.
Thanks.
Gerald
In reply to Gerald Grow
Re: HotPot inside Quizport demands that all answers be correct
by Gerald Grow -
More tests, and simpler ones, continue to produce the problem.
Look on your server for "A2-Test (GGrow)". There you will find some short quizzes using actual questions -- and these reproduce the problem, but erratically.
Note: I can't duplicate this problem with a fresh quiz created using dummy questions. The problem occurs (so far) only with "real" questions and "real" feedback.
Question: Is there something embedded in my "real" questions that is hanging up Quizport? I've looked with a text editor, and I can't find a thing.
Look on your server for "A2-Test (GGrow)". There you will find some short quizzes using actual questions -- and these reproduce the problem, but erratically.
When I try these quizzes on Mac-Firefox or Mac-Safari, or on Vista-IE7, I get erratic results in this respect:
Sometimes the Hot Potatoes quiz inside the QuizPort will not process until I have gone back and corrected every incorrect answer. (Qualification: It might possible permit one error to stand.)
Sometimes, the quizzes will process even when they contain one or two wrong (and uncorrected) choices.
Usually, if there are errors that bring the score below the required post-conditions score, the quizzes just hang. Nothing happens. Thirty seconds, nothing happens.
Other times, a quiz will be processed with such errors. But rarely.
Sometimes, the quizzes will process even when they contain one or two wrong (and uncorrected) choices.
Usually, if there are errors that bring the score below the required post-conditions score, the quizzes just hang. Nothing happens. Thirty seconds, nothing happens.
Other times, a quiz will be processed with such errors. But rarely.
Note: I can't duplicate this problem with a fresh quiz created using dummy questions. The problem occurs (so far) only with "real" questions and "real" feedback.
Question: Is there something embedded in my "real" questions that is hanging up Quizport? I've looked with a text editor, and I can't find a thing.
One question does contain a semicolon, but I don't think that's a problem.
Is the ' (apostrophe) code a problem? Some items do contain that code.
Thinking back over early versions of Hot Potatoes... (and some of these questions were created on early versions):
--GeraldThinking back over early versions of Hot Potatoes... (and some of these questions were created on early versions):
has more recent coding changed from α codes to numerical unicodes in a way that residual alpha-codes might cause a problem?
I've loaded the source files into the latest Hot Potatoes and re-saved them, with the expectation that any coding in them would thus be updated. Does that sound right?
I'm fishing for a possible cause, but I have not found one yet.
I've loaded the source files into the latest Hot Potatoes and re-saved them, with the expectation that any coding in them would thus be updated. Does that sound right?
I'm fishing for a possible cause, but I have not found one yet.
In reply to Gerald Grow
Re: HotPot inside Quizport demands that all answers be correct
by Gordon Bateson -
I tried the quiz called "AP Style, A-1-0" in the QuizPort called "AP Style, A-1-0" that you put on my server.
I selected the following wrong answers:
- 3: 747Bs
- 4: Governor Doctor + Gov., Dr. + Gov., Doctor
- 5: reformed
- 6: arrested and charged with allegedly
- 7: amidst
- 8: amuck
- 10: at, with
On all the above questions I selected every answer *except* the correct answer. In other words I did *not* select the correct answer on any of the above questions, but the quiz still finished, results were sent back to Moodle, and the quiz redisplayed.
So far I have been unable to reproduce the problem I think you are describing.
Gordon
In reply to Gordon Bateson
Re: HotPot inside Quizport demands that all answers be correct
by Gerald Grow -
This is SO bizarre! I've simplified the problem to one 3-item quiz. Two of the questions are one-word dummy questions just added in Java Hot Potatoes. One question is lifted from an actual quiz and has four choices.
This is Sample Quiz 5, inside A2Test.
No matter what combination of answers I choose -- keeping one of the three questions incorrect (yielding a score of 66%, which is below the 90% needed to advance to the next quiz -- I get erratic responses. Sometimes the quiz repeats as it should; mostly it just hangs.
Most strangely, if I choose Correct answers on Qs 1 and 3, then just keep clicking on the Wrong answers on Q 2, the quiz will eventually process.
The response is erratic. Much of the time, as long as one question continues NOT to have the correct answer checked, the quiz just hangs. Other times, with that correct answer NOT checked, the quiz processes and repeats as it should.
As soon as I can, I will get to other Internet connections, computers, and browsers and try them.
If anyone else is around to try this, please report on what results you get.
Thanks,
Gerald
P.S. This detail might be meaningful.
On the 3-item Sample Quiz 5, if I choose Incorrect answers on all 3 questions, the Quizport hangs and does not process (it should repeat the quiz).
However, if I click ALL THE OTHER WRONG ANSWERS on the one question with multiple answers, the quiz then processes -- even though no question has any correct answer checked.
Is there something in Hot Potatoes or Quizport that is counting the clicks on multiple choices and submits the quiz when all but one choice has been chosen (reasoning that the one remaining choice is the obvious correct one)?
The problem occurs ONLY when the "real" question with four choices has a wrong answer in it. Otherwise, the quiz behaves as it should.
Stumped on Labor Day Weekend... But it beats watching football.
This is Sample Quiz 5, inside A2Test.
No matter what combination of answers I choose -- keeping one of the three questions incorrect (yielding a score of 66%, which is below the 90% needed to advance to the next quiz -- I get erratic responses. Sometimes the quiz repeats as it should; mostly it just hangs.
Most strangely, if I choose Correct answers on Qs 1 and 3, then just keep clicking on the Wrong answers on Q 2, the quiz will eventually process.
The response is erratic. Much of the time, as long as one question continues NOT to have the correct answer checked, the quiz just hangs. Other times, with that correct answer NOT checked, the quiz processes and repeats as it should.
As soon as I can, I will get to other Internet connections, computers, and browsers and try them.
If anyone else is around to try this, please report on what results you get.
Thanks,
Gerald
P.S. This detail might be meaningful.
On the 3-item Sample Quiz 5, if I choose Incorrect answers on all 3 questions, the Quizport hangs and does not process (it should repeat the quiz).
However, if I click ALL THE OTHER WRONG ANSWERS on the one question with multiple answers, the quiz then processes -- even though no question has any correct answer checked.
Is there something in Hot Potatoes or Quizport that is counting the clicks on multiple choices and submits the quiz when all but one choice has been chosen (reasoning that the one remaining choice is the obvious correct one)?
The problem occurs ONLY when the "real" question with four choices has a wrong answer in it. Otherwise, the quiz behaves as it should.
Stumped on Labor Day Weekend... But it beats watching football.
In reply to Gerald Grow
Re: HotPot inside Quizport demands that all answers be correct
by Gerald Grow -
I've narrowed it down.
Gordon, on your server, see the Quizport called Sample6. It contains a single 3-question quiz, in which each question has four answers, only one correct.
When I pick the Correct answers on any two of the three questions, and an incorrect answer on the third, the quiz hangs and does not process (it is set to repeat if the score is less than 90).
I can get the quiz to process in two ways:
(1) click the correct answer (and OK), or
(2) click all the other incorrect answers but not the correct answer (and OK after each one).
This suggests that, in quizzes with multiple choices for answers, something somewhere is counting the number of attempts at answers and comparing it with the total number of choices. That count may be, at times, preventing the quiz from processing when some questions have incorrect answers.
If there is a count that says "go ahead and process the quiz if there is only one remaining unchecked answer, even if the correct answer has not yet been checked," that might explain the erratic results in quizzes where some questions have only two choices and some more choices. In those cases, sometimes quizzes would process (submit) with incorrect answers, sometimes not, depending on how many unchecked answer choices there were in a question.
I hope this helps elucidate something.
Gerald
Gordon, on your server, see the Quizport called Sample6. It contains a single 3-question quiz, in which each question has four answers, only one correct.
When I pick the Correct answers on any two of the three questions, and an incorrect answer on the third, the quiz hangs and does not process (it is set to repeat if the score is less than 90).
I can get the quiz to process in two ways:
(1) click the correct answer (and OK), or
(2) click all the other incorrect answers but not the correct answer (and OK after each one).
This suggests that, in quizzes with multiple choices for answers, something somewhere is counting the number of attempts at answers and comparing it with the total number of choices. That count may be, at times, preventing the quiz from processing when some questions have incorrect answers.
If there is a count that says "go ahead and process the quiz if there is only one remaining unchecked answer, even if the correct answer has not yet been checked," that might explain the erratic results in quizzes where some questions have only two choices and some more choices. In those cases, sometimes quizzes would process (submit) with incorrect answers, sometimes not, depending on how many unchecked answer choices there were in a question.
I hope this helps elucidate something.
Gerald
In reply to Gerald Grow
Re: HotPot inside Quizport demands that all answers be correct
by Gordon Bateson -
I think your understanding of how JQuiz multiple choice works is now correct.
(1) the quiz is not complete until all questions are complete
(2) a multiple choice question is judged to be complete if either of the following is true
(a) a correct answer is selected
(b) *all* the answers except the correct answer are selected
I think that when you started this thread you expected a single wrong answer to be sufficient for a question to considered finished. For mutiple choice questions that have only two answers, it is indeed sufficient just to pick one answer, right or wrong, and the question will be marked as completed. However, choosing just one answer on a Multiple choice question with three or more possible answers is not enough to complete the question. You must continue selecting answers on that question until you have satisfied conditions 2(a) or 2(b) above.
Does that explanation fit with your experience and current understanding?
Gordon
(1) the quiz is not complete until all questions are complete
(2) a multiple choice question is judged to be complete if either of the following is true
(a) a correct answer is selected
(b) *all* the answers except the correct answer are selected
I think that when you started this thread you expected a single wrong answer to be sufficient for a question to considered finished. For mutiple choice questions that have only two answers, it is indeed sufficient just to pick one answer, right or wrong, and the question will be marked as completed. However, choosing just one answer on a Multiple choice question with three or more possible answers is not enough to complete the question. You must continue selecting answers on that question until you have satisfied conditions 2(a) or 2(b) above.
Does that explanation fit with your experience and current understanding?
Gordon
In reply to Gordon Bateson
Re: HotPot inside Quizport demands that all answers be correct
by Gerald Grow -
Yes, that is how I understand JQZ. However, I mistakenly thought Quizport handled JQZ differently and bypassed this characteristic of JQZ.
Pedagogically, the JQZ approach makes sense. Pragmatically, however, if a student takes a Hot Potatoes JQZ and inadvertently neglects to choose the correct answer for one question out of 10 or 20 or more questions, the quiz just stops. Some students tell me, "I restarted my computer because it hung up."
There is no message at that juncture saying what to do. And I can't think of a way to get an instruction to appear at that point.
If you know of an effective way to address this blank moment, I'd appreciate hearing about it -- other than introductory instruction on how the quizzes work, followed by reminders.
Gordon, thanks for your time and attention. Sometimes I have to re-learn some basic things.
Gerald
Pedagogically, the JQZ approach makes sense. Pragmatically, however, if a student takes a Hot Potatoes JQZ and inadvertently neglects to choose the correct answer for one question out of 10 or 20 or more questions, the quiz just stops. Some students tell me, "I restarted my computer because it hung up."
There is no message at that juncture saying what to do. And I can't think of a way to get an instruction to appear at that point.
If you know of an effective way to address this blank moment, I'd appreciate hearing about it -- other than introductory instruction on how the quizzes work, followed by reminders.
Gordon, thanks for your time and attention. Sometimes I have to re-learn some basic things.
Gerald