pay-for-performance fad

pay-for-performance fad

由Joseph Rézeau發表於
Number of replies: 14
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Dear fellow moodlers,

Have you seen this piece of news?

HIALEAH, Fla. -- A new pay-for-performance program for Florida's teachers will tie raises and bonuses directly to pupils' standardized-test scores beginning next year, marking the first time a state has so closely linked the wages of individual school personnel to their students' exam results.

This is an excellent initiativeapprove and - as a responsible teacher - I am quite willing for my salary to be directly conditioned by the exam results of my students... on one condition, that is. The condition is that the same type of measure should apply to medical doctors, and of course that any doctor whose patients die should be "exterminated".dead

Have a nice day,

Joseph

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In reply to Joseph Rézeau

Re: pay-for-performance fad

由N Hansen發表於
A wise teacher would look into the levels of lead in his community and sue the government if it turns out the lead levels are high because they make his students stupid and decrease his income. He should also check the levels of tuna consumption in his community and if they are high sue the government if it turns out the mercury levels are high because that will effect the performance of his students as well. He should also sue the government to send inspectors into the homes to make sure the parents are encouraging their chilidren to study, and if they aren't, sue the government for the effect of that on his income.

I think it is a sad day when performance on tests is seen as an end in itself. Better yet, they should tie the teacher's retirement package to the income and achievements of his students once they reach adulthood, as that is the true measure of a teacher's success.
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In reply to N Hansen

Re: pay-for-performance fad

由Art Lader發表於
Okay, this is my serious response. I do not expect that everyone will like it.

If the teachers in the state of Florida and the rest of the United States allow this to happen, we are partially to blame. In fact, it is almost our fault.

What would happen if 40,000 0r 50,000 of us converged on the state capital and demanded that this foolishness stop? What if the politicians in favor of this legislation received a million emails, phone calls and faxes from us? What if we wrote ten thousand letters to the editor? What if we absolutely insisted that this bullsh*t stop?

The state representatives would pee their pants and undo what they had done. That's what would happen.

Will that be how it goes? No, not likely. We teachers will simply hope for the best and muddle through somehow. I have been teaching high school since 1979 and I have never really seen teachers stand up for themselves in any organized fashion.

Hmmm. Wonder what test they will use for German. Maybe I can get a bonus out of this. Spend a few extra weeks in Germany next year....

-- Art
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In reply to Joseph Rézeau

Re: pay-for-performance fad

由Jeffery Watkins發表於
I noticed quite early in my teaching career that students with good parents performed better all around.... socially, academically, ...etc.  Perhaps there should be a tax on parents who do not follow up with their kid's homework, who do not sit and have dinner each night with their kids.... or any other meal, who do not discipline their kids in anyway, who believe that the education of their children is the sole responsibility of the school system.

I had a parent tell me in my first year of teaching that she did not call me up when her daughter would not do the dishes, so I should not call her if she won't do her school work.... Unfortunately, a lot of us have students with parents like this.

Good Parents = Good Kids.  We as teachers have a tremendous amount of influence on some of these kids, but without good parents, it is a very up hill battle.

Jeff
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In reply to Jeffery Watkins

Re: pay-for-performance fad

由Benoit Brosseau發表於
i agree 100% with you the socio-economical factors and the level of education of the parent is a very important factor, BUT this has to be backed by a positive attitute in parrenting. i know kids with great backgrounds that are really sliping and other from far more difficult environement that are kept focus and will do great.
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In reply to Benoit Brosseau

Re: pay-for-performance fad

由N Hansen發表於
Who said that economic or level of education of the parents has anything to do with it? I disagree completely. I think I have said it before, but my husband grew up very poor with illiterate parents who never went to a day of school but his father did everything he could to ensure my husband was studying hard and doing his homework-and my husband became a physician.  I read an article a couple months ago, I think in the San Francisco Chronicle, about how a study was done showing it is the involvement of the parents in the children's lives that is important, not the  education or economic level of the parents. 
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In reply to N Hansen

Re: pay-for-performance fad

由Jeffery Watkins發表於
I said good parents, I didn't say rich or well educated parents.  Good parents are those who are involved with their children's lives.  I have seen plenty of rich, well educated parents who ignored most of what their children did.

Jeff
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In reply to Joseph Rézeau

Re: pay-for-performance fad

由Benoit Brosseau發表於
pepole are talking more and more about this here too. I think its because of the great success it was in sweeden. (any sweedish teacher here ?) anyway the reports i have read linked the fact that 10 or 15 % of the teacher salaries where performance salaries as a way to boost moral in the teaching community because the teachers had something in a form of an incentive. I am not saying i agree but here in canada i think that most pepole see this as a way to get the teacher to accept evaluation of there work. sommething the teachers have fought againt for the last 20 years. Anyway we should really find swedish teachers talk about this issues more since all my info comes from a single report.
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In reply to Benoit Brosseau

Re: pay-for-performance fad

由Art Lader發表於
Hmmm... I am a pretty motivated educator right now, but I do not worry very much about how my students will do on standardized tests. I just try to teach well and prepare them a little for the test format. The students seem to do pretty well and to be pretty happy.

After all, German is an elective course where my wife and I teach and the students keep signing up for it. And I would bet that our kids' scores on the Advanced Placement German Exam and the International Baccalaureate German Exam would impress most people who care about that sort of thing.

Tie my salary directly to their test scores and I would still be motivated, but not to be a the kind of teacher I am today. I would focus almost exclusively, I suppose, on raising test scores even higher. Frankly, I would drill them constantly and would drive content into their heads like nails into a block of wood. Drill and kill is the phrase we often use.

And we would do practice test after practice test after practice test.

They would be test-taking machines and that would put more money in my pocket.

I do not think they would love German any more, but that does not seem to be the issue here, does it?

Just my two cents, of course.

-- Art
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In reply to Art Lader

Re: pay-for-performance fad

由Benoit Brosseau發表於
i think this would be true if 40 or 50 % of your paycheck was on the line but would you change that much for 5 or 10 % ?? i really think, that its a small variation, in sweenden (i would love to found the report again) maybe even lower. I know that this is being done in florida will probably not be so low and then its a complitely other debate bacause it leads to exacttly the things your describing. Having been a young teacher i can tell that some of the teachers i have work with really need somme kind of a motivation boost. Teacher like you that are active and engage in the community never where the target of thoses policy.

I understand its an emotinal debates but i guess what i am trying to say is that, like all things, if done sensibly, with moderation and with the teacher involvment it can be a great thing. BUT like all things all so if its abuse for political and retorical reason and it becomes a tool of teacher "management" it will be a horrible thing. This type of mesure REALLY depend on ho they are implemented. 
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In reply to Benoit Brosseau

Re: pay-for-performance fad

由Art Lader發表於
Yes, as always, "the devil is in the details," right?

-- Art
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In reply to Art Lader

Re: pay-for-performance fad

由Benoit Brosseau發表於
in this case, i would say the devil is in the politicians and the bureaucrates but you call them whatever you like 眨眼
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