Doubts - Currently assessing moodle as possible platform for online course

Doubts - Currently assessing moodle as possible platform for online course

by Mariano Gutiérrez -
Number of replies: 12

Good day everyone, I'm very new here.

First and foremost, let me say hi and introduce myself, I'm Mariano from Spain, I am a professor in financial management for some entities in my country and I'm seeking to elevate my courses a little bit by taking them online. I have no clue about moodle as an administrator and I don't know these forums. I apologize If I get something wrong with this message and prompt the admins to please let me know and take whatever measures they consider.

In the past I have worked as a front-end designer so I'm fluent in some languages such as html, css, JavaScript and of the like, sadly for me though I've never been proficient in PHP or any server-side programming language and to be completely honest it's not something I really enjoy doing since I've always leaned more towards the graphic side of design.

In building my online project, I find myself researching moodle as a possible platform to use to store and manage my courses as an alternative to building a platform with basic functionalities from scratch. I believe that if moodle can meet my requirements it will save me a lot of time and money, by what I have been reading, it currently supports a fair share of the things that I'd like to implement plus a few more that I find convenient, yet, I haven't been able to find info on some of the things I believe are crucial and I came to try and clear my doubts.

So here are the things I'd like to know:

I've seen moodle management and design is handled similarly to wordpress, is that so? will implementing functionalities require for me to code a lot inside the platform or I'm good to go using plugins generally? I have a programmer on my team and he'd take care of it, generally my doubts are as to how the platform integrates on a general website regarding payments, loging, signing up and stuff like that.

Regarding missing functionalities:

1. I've seen Moodle supports stripe payments which I like. Does it support fractioned payment from stripe also? I mean, does it support all the possible payment possibilities that stripe offers?

2. Do you guys know if there is a way to add a referral system inside moodle?

3. I've seen that users need to be registered in moodle in order to access a course, fair thing; but I guess this won't require them to register in two different places right? I mean, I can just take them to a form in my site where they will register and pay for the courses and make that register page be an access to the moodle platform. I don't want to have them register in my site and in moodle separately.

4. I'd like to implement a system to prevent the same user from logging in simultaneously from 2 different IP's with the same account, do you think something like that can be put in place in moodle?

5. When I implement further courses on the moodle platform, I can set a separate payment for the new courses right? I think this is a dumb question but I wanna make sure.

Before anything, thank you guys very much for taking the time to answer me and help me with my start in moodle. I really appreciate it.

Mariano.

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In reply to Mariano Gutiérrez

Re: Doubts - Currently assessing moodle as possible platform for online course

by Visvanath Ratnaweera -
Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Translators
Hi

I have no qualifications in financial management, still taking a shot since your enquiry is taking an unusually long time (for moodle.org standards).

A preliminary: "Is Moodle is for me?" kind of questions land in the Comparisons and advocacy forum. So worth its documentation Decision FAQ and look for similar discussions there.

Your enquiry is not typical, though. You have a clear idea of the LMS you need which is not the case in many enquiries here. So you can't avoid evaluating a number of products. As far as Moodle is concerned, it is made for the purpose you've described.

But you will have a problem: Moodle is a matured product. It has reached the end of the third generation (3.x) during a life time of two decades and already designing the fourth generation (4.x). So its controls are likely to be not exactly in the places you expect. Unless you have the resources to start from scratch - some indicators estimate the cost behind Moodle to be in the order of ten million USD, if my memory serves right - it is worth carefully evaluating Moodle. It is free to test, free to run: free in the sense you don't have give your wallet no sacrifice your freedom.

To download and run the Moodle as-it-is requires no programming skills, only system administration.

Happy Moodling!
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In reply to Visvanath Ratnaweera

Re: Doubts - Currently assessing moodle as possible platform for online course

by Mariano Gutiérrez -

Hi there Visvanath and thank you very much for your answer.

Don't worry about financial management, my concern is just about how to set up all that content in a paid platform that allows me to give the best service while keeping my intellectual property secured.

I know that Moodle is a very mature product, I have made use of it as a student as my college used it and I do not intend to go form scratch to a full Moodle version LOL. I have been offered some reasonable quotes to develop a back-end site which would contain all the files and the payment systems. When I talk about features that I wasn't looking for but are convenient I talk about things like exams or progress tracking which I would not develop for my platform (at least yet)

So my question itself was more about how customizable Moodle actually is so that I could add the features that I don't see readily available.

Apparently, they are doable in the platform, and because my VPS has direct Moodle integration I think the platform will suit me just fine and I'll move along with it.

Thank you very much again for taking the time to respond, and sorry about misplacing this question!

Mariano G.

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In reply to Mariano Gutiérrez

Re: Doubts - Currently assessing moodle as possible platform for online course

by Visvanath Ratnaweera -
Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Translators
OK, it makes a big difference if you already know the functionality of core Moodle. To extend them the immediate approach is through plug-ins, whether from https://moodle.org/plugins/ or third-party (commercial) offers or of your own. Big changes to the Moodle core code is a bad idea. Soon you'll be struggling to import your changes in to newer releases of Moodle.

What is the back-end your supplier has offered?

Still no other replies here (in the General help forum). May be you want to request the moderator to move this discussion to the Comparison and advocacy forum.
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In reply to Visvanath Ratnaweera

Re: Doubts - Currently assessing moodle as possible platform for online course

by Mariano Gutiérrez -

All right, again thank you.

What I have been offered is to build a php+mysql system around a front-end design that I can provide myself and covering all the ground that I need, but obviously building security and basic interface features will be much slower than if Moodle provides them readily built.

Particularly what I'm more concerned about is the capacity to prevent my students from sharing user and password, since many of them belong to a specific company and are acquaintances of each other. Everything else such as payment and referral systems is something that I can set up using Stripe.

So it makes me think when you say that changes in the core of moodle may drive me crazy in the future. Though I only care about that simultaneous login feature.

My server is currently supporting moodle 3.7, and I guess It will get updated soon enough to a more newer version. Do we have a estimated time for the launch of moodle 4.0?

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In reply to Mariano Gutiérrez

Re: Doubts - Currently assessing moodle as possible platform for online course

by Visvanath Ratnaweera -
Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Translators
So the proposed solution is an additional front-end, a web-based GUI, for your additional administrative tasks, which are not covered in Moodle. Though I haven't seen one, the idea seems doable - but going to be something much bigger that a mere plug-in. As usual, successfully attaching the new sub-system to Moodle is one thing, maintaining to match the developments in Moodle over the years to come is a different thing. That is an obvious statement, just to be clear.

What surprises me is, all that work just to "care about that simultaneous login feature". Sounds like an over-kill to me. You saw https://docs.moodle.org/en/Managing_authentication#Limit_concurrent_logins, right? Before we dive too deep, there is a limit to what technology can do to correct human misbehaviour, I believe. ;)

The release plan of Moodle is here: https://docs.moodle.org/dev/Releases.

Good luck!

P.S. We are still in the General help forum. Advocacy could be a better forum. (Please don't repost, request the moderator to move the discussion.)

P.P.S. There is also a Moodle for Business community, https://moodle.org/course/view.php?id=32, which is separate from Moodle in English. If you want to post there, pl. provide them with a link to this discussion.
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In reply to Visvanath Ratnaweera

Re: Doubts - Currently assessing moodle as possible platform for online course

by Mariano Gutiérrez -
Hello Again Visvanath and thank you again for your response. There have been many in the last 24h, I'll try to respond to as many as I can.

First off, It does look like that concurrent login control can somehow do a bit of the trick, it definitely eases my mind a little. I do not intend to stop them completely from cheating, I just want to make it slightly more difficult for them.

However maybe I did not explain myself clearly. The idea is not a front-end build GUI for those things not covered in moodle. The idea is either black or white. I mean, either I go with moodle and try to tweak the couple things it doesn't cover itself OR I create an interface by myself and throw some back end around it to handle payment, login, password reset, database management and all that.

For now, moodle seems to be taking the lead, because it's easier and more mature. However right now I feel like you guys are throwing at me information faster than I can process it LOL, and I want to try a demo version before deciding, then another answer below suggests that I install it from scratch 😂😂😂 or that I use moodle cloud and I don't know where to start. 

Definitely need to try. Really thankful about that storm of responses though.


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In reply to Mariano Gutiérrez

Re: Doubts - Currently assessing moodle as possible platform for online course

by Rick Jerz -
Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Testers
I will add just a few more thoughts for you, Mariano. Earlier you said, "my VPS has direct Moodle integration" and right above you said "My server is currently supporting moodle 3.7." This leads me to believe that you are using some kind of one-step installation tool, such as Softaculous, to install your moodle. If so, my suggestion is don't. Learn to install moodle from scratch.

It appears that you want a student to only login from one ip address. What do you want to do if they decide to use their smartphone, and being mobile, might have different natural ip addresses? Or will your students be required to only work from their office and always from the exact same computer?

On the human side, I don't know how to stop people from sharing their login credentials. This is a different kind of problem. If you could solve this problem, then you might not need to go through a lot of programming effort. Also, how do you plan to detect that student1 logs in from their computer, and then student2 sits behind student1's computer?

If I don't understand your situation correctly and off-base, simply ignore what I have said. (No problem.)
Other folks here are providing some good guidance. 
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In reply to Rick Jerz

Re: Doubts - Currently assessing moodle as possible platform for online course

by Mariano Gutiérrez -
I have no clue of what system the server uses to install Moodle but yes, it's basically a one-step installation thing, I might use that to do a quick test and then try to install it from scratch.

About the concurrent login feature, I don't mind the students logging in from different IP's, what I was intending was to stop them from logging in from two different IP's at the same time. 

Basically what I would like is to try and make it a bit harder for them to share their credentials as that is a real possibility with them being mainly from one company alone. There is obviously nothing I can do about them seeing the content together as you suggest. There is nothing I could do to avoid them from meeting and seeing the content together or from agreeing on a time and using the same credentials. Again, I know I can't completely prevent that, I just want to make it a bit more complicated.
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In reply to Mariano Gutiérrez

Re: Doubts - Currently assessing moodle as possible platform for online course

by Beatriz Rojo -
Hi Mariano,
I have no idea about programming and networks, I just use Moodle using the interface and all the buttons and options it has. From my experience, Moodle is daunting and overwhelming for a teaching person without deep knowledge of everything you and Visvanath have. If you don't know how to install and maintain it, I think you risk to offer a poor learning experience to your participants. But that doesn't seem to be your case 😊.
So, from my experience:
  • Moodle is absolutely customizable. As Visvanath said, you have a huge amount of plugins that you can use for almost every need you might have.
  • As an Admin, you can also deactivate what you don't need. For instance, in my current scenario, we use Slack as a communication channel, so I have deactivated forums, chat, and internal notifications. 
  • Regarding the look&feel, it's the weakest part of Moodle. But you said you like design, and Moodle is flexible enough to make it more attractive. I tune a little my courses with icons, collapsed topics, blocks, and other simple tweaks, and participants commented that it's different from the Moodle courses they have seen before.
I hope these suggestions helped you!
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In reply to Beatriz Rojo

Re: Doubts - Currently assessing moodle as possible platform for online course

by Mariano Gutiérrez -
Thank you so very much for your response Beatriz, I found it very insightful 😊😊

Would you mind sharing some screenshots of your courses to see what you mean when you say yours are a bit custom? I might get some ideas. I'm gonna run some moodle tests right now in my server and having your examples I might get a clearer idea of where I stand and what I want to get. Because I really do care about experience and I don't want it to be so much poorer than a design I can do myself with crystal clear content and guidelines.
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In reply to Mariano Gutiérrez

Re: Doubts - Currently assessing moodle as possible platform for online course

by Colin Fraser -
And my 3 cents, (it's used to be 2 cents but with inflation and Covid... ah, you know..)
So far, I have not heard of a teaching and learning scenario where Moodle has failed. So Moodle will fit any given environment, I suggest. What makes it work is how the Moodle is actually used, have Users been informed of Moodle, is there training available to learn it? In so many cases, Admins seem to think students just soak it up out of the air.
Same for teachers, have they been trained in the essentials, have they been using something else and have to make a swap? I suggest you could read the very first post in this forum, think about how that can apply to your situation.
If you want to test Moodle, without getting too involved, perhaps you might set up a freebie course in Moodle Cloud, see what you need to make a course. See how students enrolled react to using Moodle. Doesn't have to be anything too complex, say, something to do with the students current understanding of a new topic like general financial vocabulary, ethics in finance, assuming there are ethics beyond making money, economies through the Great Depression or any such thing, as long as students have some sort of quiz, have to watch a video, provide an online assignment, an uploaded assignment, or any combination of the different assessment types.
Good luck.
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In reply to Colin Fraser

Re: Doubts - Currently assessing moodle as possible platform for online course

by Mariano Gutiérrez -
You raised the flag on this one Colin.

I assume students will me more or less capable of using the platform should I simply put a walkthrough video at the beginning and try to make it as simple as possible for them to follow the syllabus. Again that's why I need to use a beta version to see what a student will see and how feasible or easy will it be for me to adjust the configurations to my liking.

Yesterday it was impossible for me to run the tests so I'm gonna try to do that right now even if it's with the one-step install on a temporary directory so that I can get a first-hand experience of a non-tuned moodle.
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