Martin, I like the idea of the possibility of multi-page resources very much. When I taught online before, I created in my course a series of "lectures" on various topics. These consisted of sometimes multi-paged texts with associated images. I wanted to break things up into multiple pages because sometimes loading all the text and images on one page took a long time and required a lot of scrolling.
I also like the book module, but I have a concern with the concept of a "book" within the current Moodle structure. In a typical classroom course, a student is often supposed to read certain chapters or pages of a larger book as a course progresses. As is, Moodle is set up so that from within a specific topic or week, you can insert an entire activity. If a whole book is a single activity, how could one associate just a certain chapter of that book with a particular topic or week easily without having to resort to some sort of workaround?
Hi n,
Why would the whole book have to be a single activity? It doesn't have to be. You could add a "book" activity to each topic/week that includes only the pages/chapters that pertain to that topic/week.
Because it might be nice to have the option to read the book as a whole, or as parts. Imagine you had an English teacher posting a novel for their students to read and they were supposed to discuss a chapter each week, but students might want to read the whole book in one sitting. It would be rather awkward to have to go to separate chapters. That's not a book in my mind, that's a bunch of multi-page resources.
So, an extra button in each book, that can harvest all the books in that course in one file and let you - as student(?) - exclude some of the harvest books before printing?
Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeee CRASH.
(sound of trees being cut down...)
(sound of trees being cut down...)
Ahead of the heard we placed at our local University in 1995 all the resources for the students on our very advanced local network, saving lots of trees for the replaced student-workbooks (and students saved money: 25$ per workbook)
Then we saw how our students made page by page print-outs of all these computer pages:
- costed them much more then $25
- Ending up with lots of ugly pages with lots of empty spaces (= cut more trees)
- Book suffers from the same disease: in your print-out it creates lots of white pages by respecting the end-of-page comand in the print-out-view (One of my teacher made this complaint)
What is Moodle, part 29:
Some teachers are born course-writers and can create nice products with any tool, even BB. For us, the other teachers and professors, there is Moodle: to help us to bring more (topic-oriented) structure in our courses. Book is also a great starters-help for putting content easy in place inside that structure... (with the danger of ending up with good old "turning pages", but that is an other story....)
If teachers see the sections as the topic-chapters of their course (as Martin proposes?) and call these books in these sections also chapters, then for a beginner a button to harvest these chapters in one print-out-view (and exclude some books by hand) would be a great help/relief.
All the other experts just cut and past the single books into Word and do in Word their prepress by hand: these guys and dolls like computers and the rythm of clicking their mouse, do not automate for them these activities, they will hate you for that, but do it for us, the simple course creatures/creators.)
Rule of thumb: repect the bad habbits of your users - like making a print - and they will love you
I'm not arguing about the finer points of how to print something out ... I'm saying they should not have to print out multi-page resources at all. Ever. Take their printers away. 
Designer mistake number one: Do NOT repect the bad habbits of your users - like making a print. (like I did )
By the way, I asked the maker of the modul to make a pdf instead of a printout-view, but he refuses to do that until now
... he does not refuse, he does not know how to do it 
You can do it easily even now:
You can do it easily even now:
- print book to pdf (using PDFCreator for example),
- disable print icons,
- upload pdf file to course file,
- make a link from some chapter to uploaded pdf.
Oops, sorry, I thought you were an php-expert, because you created such a nice modul.
(For me you stay an expert )
(I rememeber that you said it should stay easy, I read that as easy for the user, not for you as contstructor )
- If the user installs virtual printers like PDFCreator, your first line (alone) is elegant (..only, what about the page-breaks?)
- But that "If the user installs..." is a problem for a normal user at home.
- At the institute the admin controls the machines, you have to convince him that it is necessary..
- 2 is for Martin and Charelle
- 3 + 4 is for another kind of users: the computer-expert, book is for the beginner who wants to start simple by filling in a set of forms.
Your original 1+2+3+4 is for the mouse-lovers
The problem with PDF is that it is very hard to convert general HTML to PDF. Various PDF libraries are designed for outputting simple forms and text with little formatting. If you want to convert rich text HTML (graphics, tables, etc.) to PDF, you need to:
There are some solutions, but they are not pure PHP (because they use GhostScript and other programs) - IMO no hosting company would allow such thing on their server.
It is much, much easier to install PDFcreator on teachers's computer. The page breaks do work (at least in my IE and Firefox) - try File/Print Preview. If you have Firefox, check the appearance of links too
answer to previous post:
- download HTML page,
- render HTML to PostScript,
- generate PDF by GhostScript,
- update page numbers in TOC.
There are some solutions, but they are not pure PHP (because they use GhostScript and other programs) - IMO no hosting company would allow such thing on their server.
It is much, much easier to install PDFcreator on teachers's computer. The page breaks do work (at least in my IE and Firefox) - try File/Print Preview. If you have Firefox, check the appearance of links too
answer to previous post:
- it is necessary to install only on teachers computers, students do not need it,
- there is a new option for disabling of printing icons and also titles,
- uploading of files - all tutors should already know how to do it,
- inserting of links - all tutors already know how to do it.
Yes, it is the choice between giving the user freedom and ending up with an HTML-mess
or
Restrict the user to fill-in the fields of a form and choose from a set of layouts. (Chardelle's book layout is a good candidate for that.)
I made a not working dummy of this idea, but am still looking how to implemnt that
https://elo1.hetstedelijk.org/pdfVB/index.php
based on such standalone pdf-lib:
If your only design criteria is popularity with people who don't understand what computers can do then, sure, but have you seen the episode of the Simpsons where Homer's brother lets him design a car?
Would be great to have one identical PDF button in Moodle, so the normal user could create PDFs everywhere. (And take them off-line on their laptop during a traintrip)
In normal life, there ARE cars with these stupid options: consider the glass roof of a peugeot 307, or all these "off the road designs" for people who never leave the road.
The cleverness of the designer is to design a still useful Swiss-army knife (with USB-plug ) instead of a Belgium police knife (Sorry Koen).
I think it's pretty much the same thing .. for example, imagine if you just renamed the current Book module to "Chapter" without any other changes ... you could have one per week, but still see them all listed sequentially on the "index" page of all Chapters .. it would look like a book there.
Realistically I don't think teachers are going to be publishing entire novels this way ... it might be better to provide them in downloadable pdf or ebook format, that is assuming they could even get the rights to distribute them.
Realistically I don't think teachers are going to be publishing entire novels this way ... it might be better to provide them in downloadable pdf or ebook format, that is assuming they could even get the rights to distribute them.
Hi,
For some points of reference since I'm working in them right now...
Moodle -> Book
WebCT Campus Edition -> Content Module
WebCT Vista -> Learning Module
Blackboard 6 -> Learning Unit
All four have the same feature of linking page togethers with "Previous|Next" navigation buttons and a Table of Contents built dynamcially when pages are added, removed or shuffled around.
The prime difference between a Moodle Book right now and the other CMS "things" is the ability to add other components as pages such as quizzes, assignments and discussion topics.
Personally, I like the "book" name. When I train faculty in using WebCT, I often give an analogy to think of a content module/learning module like a "three ring binder" where we can insert, remove, shuffle pages along with other resources like "pocket pages" to hold pencils, calculators, sticky notes, paper clips, etc. (WebCT content/learning modules have an additional "Action menubar" where we can include other things like quizzes, URL links, etc to support the content but not in be the content sequence.)
Maybe instead of "book" consider "notebook" or "binder"?
Cheers,
Bob
Some thoughts:
1. Printing--turn off the ability to print unless your book pages are plain simple text only(which Petr has graciously now included the ability to do). (I just put a corporate client's employee handbook online with the book module--now they no longer give out the handbook willy nilly to employees--save the trees!)
2. The last page of my books are called Print and Exit. It includes a pdf icon that links to a nice printer-friendly (none of the images or fancy stuff) pdf of the book text. I also include an Exit Workbook button that takes the user back to the course homepage just to keep in line with the forward linearity of the book. Ger, why would you want to give your students options as to how the pdf will be laid out?
3. In each of my books (one per topic) I include journaling questions with a link (I like to keep things cohesive so the link includes the module icon image) that brings the journal up in a new window. Then, when they are finished users can just close the window to return to the book. And there are discussion topics that open the forum in a window, and the same if that module inculdes a quiz, or poll, etc. I suppose you could also add these links to a section of the book so that they are visible at all times to the user, e.g. a section of each page that has a link to a calculator, a URL, etc.
4. The links to all of the "extras" for that topic can be put into a folder under the book link if there are too many and they clutter things up.
1. I prefer that the user can decide to have a paper copy or not. Educate them to save the trees and offer them better alternatives then the printed book wher you can plcae remarks on the pages and make bookmarks..
2. If you can do all this work outside the computer, I am wondering if you are using tools like GemDoc ($99) or Aurigadoc (free) or my toy Toot-o-matic (IBM) to write one Structured source and create different outputs from that only resource. even all the linking you create would survive in this approach
HTML(single and multi page), DHTML, PDF, PostScript, Formatting Object(FO), RTF, Java Help and HTML Help(.chm).
3./4 I like the way you organise the book in its environment with these multiple (structured ) ways to access the same resources+activities
My intention is to have a layout choice for the norml teacher: he/she could choose your booktheme and then gets two fill-in boxes, side by side, instead of this cut and paste table-stuff to do the trick
I must admit.
I really like the name "Book". It's a lot cooler and to me really describes the mod.
WP1
I really like the name "Book". It's a lot cooler and to me really describes the mod.
WP1
Does it? "Book: A set of written, printed, or blank pages fastened along one side and encased between protective covers."
Book is a set of pages
eBook is a "standard" (Book does not follow that standard)
mBook could be a book in Moodle
You've got some good ideas here Ger. Let us know if you get them implemented.
From the great ideas in this post, here I have taken the resource links out of the book pages and added a "resource toolbar" to the top of the book page in the html editor. This way these links are "not in the content sequence", and are always visible and available throughout the book.
(Wouldn't it be great to have an add resource menu on the book editing page?)
QUOTE:
(Wouldn't it be great to have an add resource menu on the book editing page?) Chardelle Busch.
I was thinking about the same thing, but, also an "Activities" as well as the "Resources" dropdown selector while in "Editing" mode. I wonder how it would work if you have a customized backgroud like you do Chardelle.
WP1
(Wouldn't it be great to have an add resource menu on the book editing page?) Chardelle Busch.
I was thinking about the same thing, but, also an "Activities" as well as the "Resources" dropdown selector while in "Editing" mode. I wonder how it would work if you have a customized backgroud like you do Chardelle.
WP1
I do not fully understand what should "resource toolbar" do. Could you give some more examples of usage?
I am recovering from my vacation and studying the new resource module. I am also planning some internal changes in book structure.
I do not want to make book too much complicated, maybe it would be nice to have some switch for "new users" and "advanced users". Beginners would see only a few options, but advanced users could set all the options. Moodle in general is gaining many new features and some day it becomes too complicated for beginners...
I am recovering from my vacation
I do not want to make book too much complicated, maybe it would be nice to have some switch for "new users" and "advanced users". Beginners would see only a few options, but advanced users could set all the options. Moodle in general is gaining many new features and some day it becomes too complicated for beginners...
Petr,
Chardelle's "resource toolbar" is very similar to the "Action Menubar" found in WebCT Campus Edition Content Modules and WebCT Vista Learning Modules. The Action Menubar has been around since the beginningof WebCT.
A Moodle Resource Toolbar (WebCT Action Menubar) is a way to provide resources that support the content but are not required to be in the linear sequence of reading the content. For example, I might have some content that includes some URLs of additional information on another web site. In the content, there might even be a "see the links in the resource toolbar for further information". A few common component in the past has been self-tests, glossaries and student notes.
Quizzes are another component that can be placed either in sequence of the module or on the toolbar of a page. If the quiz is optional so the student can improve learning, then it goes on the toolbar of the page. But if I want the student to take the quiz after reading the content, then it goes on the "next page" after the content so there is a better chance of not missing it.
Resource toolbar is a good way to provide extras while keeping the student on a particular page.
Cheers,
Bob
Hi all,
Petr, it must have been a helluva vacation if you are still recovering
. You are right, things could get way too complicated. (But have you ever seen Ray's Lesson module?--yikes, I still haven't figured it out quite)
And WP--yes actually I really meant "activities" in moodle terms.
Ok, so I was going along the lines like Bob mentioned about Web-you-know-who's Action menubar. In my example, I have added the links to the actual book page--just above my book background. I was thinking of being able to add a link to a resource or activity and have it be placed on the page (not in the html editor box WP, so it wouldn't mess with the background)--in other words imagine the discussion and journal links I added in my picture moved up out of the "book page" and placed next to where your print links are now skodak.
The other circle in the picture was really a fantasy of having the "add an activity" drop down menu on the book page in order to say, add a discussion link to the page. So say, either above or below the "book page" you could have a little menu bar with links to files, activities, resources, etc.
(But for now, anyone can add their own "menubar" by adding the links via html to the "book page" like I did in my example. It's a little hard to see in the picture, but I just inserted a table w/a blue border above my book background and added a link to my forum icon and the topic forum, and a link to my journal icon and the journal for this particular topic.)
Chardelle
In reply to Chardelle Busch
Re: Book module --> Multipage Resource (or Moodle inside Moodle?)
by N Hansen -
Maybe I am misunderstand what you are proposing here, but it starts to sound like we are putting a Moodle inside a Moodle. In other words, if you are able to add activities inside a book, then you are starting to create something that offers all the capabilities of Moodle, but has a different structure. I think this runs the risk of mixing navigation structures within a single course inconsistently and confusing students.
However, I think the idea is an excellent one, but it is starting to me to sound more suitable to a new course format-a book format. Rather than divide the course up into weeks or topics, students are expected to follow a narrational sequence, the book is the central part of the course, and from within that narrational sequence they gain access to other related activities. You might allow multiple books as well in a single course. Such a format would probably be very useful to literature teachers for example. What do you guys think?
However, I think the idea is an excellent one, but it is starting to me to sound more suitable to a new course format-a book format. Rather than divide the course up into weeks or topics, students are expected to follow a narrational sequence, the book is the central part of the course, and from within that narrational sequence they gain access to other related activities. You might allow multiple books as well in a single course. Such a format would probably be very useful to literature teachers for example. What do you guys think?
Please stop hassling Petr, everyone!
Multi-page resources are a relatively simple but very useful thing just as they are ... let's see that first. The Book module will not be in Moodle 1.4.
I've split these posts into a new discussion where you can dream to your hearts content about subsections and multiple activities per page.
Multi-page resources are a relatively simple but very useful thing just as they are ... let's see that first. The Book module will not be in Moodle 1.4.
I've split these posts into a new discussion where you can dream to your hearts content about subsections and multiple activities per page.
Now that there is a stable release of the book module, I just installed it on my Moodle. In doing so, I have come up with a satisfactory (but not perfect) answer to the question that I posted at the beginning of this thread, and I wanted to share it with others who might be interested in doing something similar.
Here's what I would do. I'll be working in topics format, with each topic corresponding to a chapter in an offline textbook that the students will be using in my course. I am creating a set of my own notes (my book) to accompany this textbook, with a chapter in my book corresponding to each chapter in the offline book. I will put the book itself into the topic outline. If people click on it there, they will be taken to an introductory chapter that explains the purpose of the book. Then in each of the topics, I will create a resource. I will make its type "web link," and link to the page for the relevant chapter in the book.
Why is this solution not perfect? Two reasons come to mind:
Here's what I would do. I'll be working in topics format, with each topic corresponding to a chapter in an offline textbook that the students will be using in my course. I am creating a set of my own notes (my book) to accompany this textbook, with a chapter in my book corresponding to each chapter in the offline book. I will put the book itself into the topic outline. If people click on it there, they will be taken to an introductory chapter that explains the purpose of the book. Then in each of the topics, I will create a resource. I will make its type "web link," and link to the page for the relevant chapter in the book.
Why is this solution not perfect? Two reasons come to mind:
- The fact that the icons used for book and resource differ may confuse people (although in my Moodle this won't be an issue because I am using the same hieroglyphic icon for both activities).
- If someone clicks on the resources link in the activities block, they will see all of the individual chapters listed. If they click on the books link they will see the whole book. A work around for this would be to hide the activities block altogether. In some cases, this might be OK because there would be no need to see all the activities grouped in that manner, but it would depend on the individual needs of the course.