Hi,
I am using Moodle 1.9.9+
I want to create a quiz where students are shown Y number of questions. Out of this, they can choose to answer any X out of given Y questions (X < Y) Even if they attempt all the Y questions, they should still get grades for only X questions. All questions are of equal grade. I want to do this for Essay type of questions urgently but will require for other type of questions too, in the future.
This is really such a common thing in offline exams that I wonder why on earth can't I implement this using Moodle. I really must be missing something even after looking around in the plugins, FAQ and just the 1st page of Quiz module forum.
Tim will probably comment on the "why on earth" part. I'm just wondering. The X questions marks should add up to 100. Assuming that the instructor does not mark extra answers (leaving automatically marked questions aside for a moment) the real value of the quiz grade in the gradebook should be 0-100 even though the max grade is say 120 (of all Y questions; the quiz max grade should be adjust to the total points so that points per question will be an absolute value). So, if in the gradebook you work with the real values of these items (rather than percentage) there shouldn't be a problem, right? 
Dear Itamar (and Tim),
Yes, I am using Real values of the items... I will try having maximum marks as the marks of X questions and get back.
Please ignore the "why on earth" comment ;)
Yes, I am using Real values of the items... I will try having maximum marks as the marks of X questions and get back.
Please ignore the "why on earth" comment ;)
Knight Samar "This is really such a common thing in offline exams that I wonder why on earth can't I implement this using Moodle."
I've been a teacher for 44 years and this is the first time I hear of this "choose X out of Y questions" exam type which you call "a common thing".
All the time in this Moodle Quiz forum we see questions by users who want to do all kinds of (strange) things with the Quiz activity. And every user insists that what they want to do is "quite common" and wonders why the Quiz activity does not have that very important (to them) setting. I confess that I must have posted that kind of question here myself in the past.
What must be understood is that the various ways of administering quizzes (and the various questions types in them), in countries all over the world, are almost infinite, whereas the Moodle quiz settings have to be finite (and also Tim's time is finite).
All the best,
Joseph
PS.- For your current problem, here is how you can solve it.
- In your quiz, create e.g. 3 Essay type questions, each question with a score of 10 points. Total score for quiz = 10 points.
- Instruct the students to answer 2 questions of their choice. When the students have submitted their quiz, teacher goes over their answers and marks the 2 questions that have been answered per student.
- When quiz has been submitted, teacher goes to Quiz Overview, clicks on student's name and grades each Essay question that has been answered, e.g. out of 10.
- When finished, teacher clicks on Regrade button.
- Now, of course, the scores are too low, because they are counted out of 3 * 10 = 30 points but each student can only earn a maximum of 2 * 10 = 20 points by answering only 2 questions of their choice.
- Solution: Go to Grades ► Categories and items ► Full view and, in the Multiplicator column of your Quiz, replace 1.0 with 1.5. (that multiplicator figure = total number of questions / number of questions to be answered)
- Example. Student A scored 4/10 for Q1 and 6/10 for Q3 : total quiz score = 10/30 = 3.33/10. Final total score for Student A for Quiz after Multiplicator has been applied = 5/10.
Dear Joseph,
I fully agree with you that I might have gone completely overboard using "why on earth" and "a common thing". I was just perplexed after 2 days of tinkering around in Moodle and then one night of Moodle search I had no intentions of blaming Moodle
About the "choose X out of Y questions", I think I should put it in better words. I meant "Attempt any X out of total Y questions" Maybe, that sounds correct...?
Finally thanks for the wonderful solution! I will try it out completely (I am stuck on the step 6 trying to find Categories and Items) and return back with results.
I guess, as you said, the varying ways of administering Moodle and "localizing" it, is what makes it so difficult to talk about but at the same time so interesting and "fuller"
Regards,
Samar
I fully agree with you that I might have gone completely overboard using "why on earth" and "a common thing". I was just perplexed after 2 days of tinkering around in Moodle and then one night of Moodle search
About the "choose X out of Y questions", I think I should put it in better words. I meant "Attempt any X out of total Y questions"
Finally thanks for the wonderful solution! I will try it out completely (I am stuck on the step 6 trying to find Categories and Items) and return back with results.
I guess, as you said, the varying ways of administering Moodle and "localizing" it, is what makes it so difficult to talk about but at the same time so interesting and "fuller"
Regards,
Samar
Hi Samar,
Never mind the "why on earth" thing. I quite understand your frustration and I hope the solution I proposed will work for your needs.
Important: I hope you are using one of the latest versions of moodle 1.9 (currently 1.9.9).
Step 6: Logged into the course as teacher, in the Administration block, click the Grades link, which takes you to the course Grades (also called Gradebook) page. On that page you can see the grades for all of the course activities. In the Choose an action dropdown list at the top left corner, select Categories and items ► Full view.
On that page, go to the quiz which contains the "choose X out of Y questions" instructions, and change the multiplicator in the multiplicator column (see attached screenshot).
By using the correct multiplicator (as explained in my previous post) the student scores for that quiz will show correctly in their gradebook. It will be calculated out of the X questions they have answered. However, please note that the quiz will still show their incorrect score (calculated out of the score for Y questions, not X). That cannot be changed, you'll have to explain it to the students if you allow them to review their answers and scores...
Note.- Since there is not automatic checking mechanism for preventing the students from answering more than X out of Y questions, in case a student answers more than X questions, when the teacher manually marks the essays, it's up to the teacher to only award marks to X questions (and leave the extra n questions at their default 0 score, maybe writing some comment there for the student : this extra question will get you no score, etc.).
All the best,
Joseph
Hi Joseph,
I had the same issue of " Attempt any x out of y questions".
I followed your instractions but the result was not what I expected.
let me explain what i mean giving you an example.
I have one quiz with four (4) questions each one of a score of 10 points. Total score for the quiz is 10 points.
Student have to answer two (2) questions. For Q1 student scored 10 points and for Q2 scored 10 points (is a good one). Which means total score for quiz =20/40 (40 points for all the questions) =5/10.
So the final score for quiz for this student (after multiplicator has been applied which I replaced from 1.0 to 2.0) =10/10.
Instead of this it shows "final score for the quiz=5/10."
What am I doing wrong;
Thank you in advance.
regards
Konstantinos.
Quote from my previous post:
By using the correct multiplicator (as explained in my previous post) the student scores for that quiz will show correctly in their gradebook. It will be calculated out of the X questions they have answered. However, please note that the quiz will still show their incorrect score (calculated out of the score for Y questions, not X). That cannot be changed, you'll have to explain it to the students if you allow them to review their answers and scores...
Joseph
Thank you very much Joseph.
Regards,
Konstantinos.
Nice work-around from Joseph that I hope solves your immediate problem.
There are several requirements relating to which questions make up a quiz that do not fit into the current data model. They are this one, and the one about having one quiz where different questions contribute to different 'category totals', rather than a single total for the whole quiz. (For example, a maths quiz that gives you a score for addition, and a separate score for subtraction.)
What is the current data-model for the quiz, well a quiz is just a fixed list of questions, divided into separate pages. You can have random questions (this slot in the quiz is filled by a question picked at random from this category.) And the overall order of the questions can be randomised.
I agree that is limited, but that is where we are now, and it does satisfy a lot of the people a lot of the time.
However, one day, I am sure, someone will do all the work necessary to overcome this limitation, but it will be quite a lot of work. (And I can confidently predict that I won't have time to work on this for more than a year, but if anyone else wants a go, I would try to help.)
What needs to be done?
1. Work out what the new data-model for the quiz should be. Of course, we need to support everything Moodle currently does, and the popular feature requests. Also, I would suggest reading the T part of the IMS QTI specification to ensure that anything QTI can do will be supported by Moodle.
2. Given this new data-model, work the database structure required to store it, and how to upgrade from the current structure.
3. Work out how the quiz editing interface has to change so teachers can use all the new functionality, but, at the same time, the interface should not become any more complicated for a teacher sitting down to create their first ever Moodle quiz. That is, we will need careful use of progressive disclosure.
4. Work out how the quiz navigation, review page and quiz reports have to change to support the new, more complex data-structure.
5. Write the code and test it.
Note that this issue was already on my long-term TODO list for the quiz Development:Goals of an online assessment system#A_richer_model_for_which_questions_are_in_a_quiz, though I just extended that section a bit.
If anyone wants to have a go at fleshing out point 1-4 in more detail, you are welcome to give it a go on Moodle Docs.
There are several requirements relating to which questions make up a quiz that do not fit into the current data model. They are this one, and the one about having one quiz where different questions contribute to different 'category totals', rather than a single total for the whole quiz. (For example, a maths quiz that gives you a score for addition, and a separate score for subtraction.)
What is the current data-model for the quiz, well a quiz is just a fixed list of questions, divided into separate pages. You can have random questions (this slot in the quiz is filled by a question picked at random from this category.) And the overall order of the questions can be randomised.
I agree that is limited, but that is where we are now, and it does satisfy a lot of the people a lot of the time.
However, one day, I am sure, someone will do all the work necessary to overcome this limitation, but it will be quite a lot of work. (And I can confidently predict that I won't have time to work on this for more than a year, but if anyone else wants a go, I would try to help.)
What needs to be done?
1. Work out what the new data-model for the quiz should be. Of course, we need to support everything Moodle currently does, and the popular feature requests. Also, I would suggest reading the T part of the IMS QTI specification to ensure that anything QTI can do will be supported by Moodle.
2. Given this new data-model, work the database structure required to store it, and how to upgrade from the current structure.
3. Work out how the quiz editing interface has to change so teachers can use all the new functionality, but, at the same time, the interface should not become any more complicated for a teacher sitting down to create their first ever Moodle quiz. That is, we will need careful use of progressive disclosure.
4. Work out how the quiz navigation, review page and quiz reports have to change to support the new, more complex data-structure.
5. Write the code and test it.
Note that this issue was already on my long-term TODO list for the quiz Development:Goals of an online assessment system#A_richer_model_for_which_questions_are_in_a_quiz, though I just extended that section a bit.
If anyone wants to have a go at fleshing out point 1-4 in more detail, you are welcome to give it a go on Moodle Docs.