Clarification on Moodle features

Clarification on Moodle features

by Jeremy Davis -
Number of replies: 8

Hi there! smile

After spending copious time searching and reading all about Moodle (here mostly, but also elsewhere via google) I think I am less sure than I weas to start with... Basically I need to get some clarity around what Moodle can and can't do at this point in time and/or how and/or what options I may have if I choose to go with Moodle.

Ok so what I need is an LMS. Yep, Moodle is all over that!

But my organisation is an RTO in Australia and we have the Govt requirement of maintaining student records/evidence for 30 yrs. Is that something that Moodle can handle OOTB? Or does Moodle interface with something else that can do that? (Someone suggested Mahara, although I haven't looked enough to be sure yet).

What about versioning of learning materials/assessment tools (for Govt mandated quality control/assurance?I have been looking at a DMS (Document Management System) such as KnowledgeTree but if Moodle can handle this OOTB then perhaps not? Or does it/could it integrate with a third party DMS (prefer open source - KnowledgeTree even?)

What about integration with student management type software such as VetTrak? (Student data/enrolment/qualification/certification databasing as well as AVETMIS reporting). We already have VetTrak (wasn't my choice...) so ideally would be keen to interface with that. The software developers have said that there is facility for that from their end (via an API which has to be purchased separately).

Would love to hear from anyone who has any experience with any of the above, but most of all on success stories of interagtion (or that Moodle can already do it). I'm sure these questions have been asked elsewhere (I found lots when searching, but most were years old...) Some recent/current info and state-of-play would be invaluable.

Thanks in advance! smile

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In reply to Jeremy Davis

Re: Clarification on Moodle features

by Marcus Green -
Picture of Core developers Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers

What is an RTO and what is AVETMIS?

In reply to Marcus Green

Re: Clarification on Moodle features

by Jeremy Davis -

Sorry for the lack of clarity/jargon.

RTO is the Australian acronym for Registered Training Organisation (you cannot give Australian certificate level +  qualifications unless you are one or are auspiced by one).

AVETMISS (sorry I forgot an 'S') stands for Australian Vocational Education and Training Management Information Statistical Standard. It is the mandated data that must be regularly provided to Govt to maintain RTO status.

In reply to Jeremy Davis

Re: Clarification on Moodle features

by Colin Fraser -
Picture of Documentation writers Picture of Testers

"But my organisation is an RTO in Australia and we have the Govt requirement of maintaining student records/evidence for 30 yrs. Is that something that Moodle can handle OOTB? "

Jeremy, you understand how ludicrous that requirement is don't you. Apart from the obvious space requirements, how many RTOs are going to be able to survive that long?  Agghhh another argument I lost... damnit. To answer your question, yes, Moodle backups can be stored on discs for the required time. Whether the technology will be available to read them is a completely different question. Are RTOs required to maintain the old technologies just to be able to read them or will the RTOs be constantly upgrading their archives to new technology standards to make sure that compatibility issues do not prevent access to that material to meet that expectation? Anybodies guess... 

  "What about versioning of learning materials/assessment tools (for Govt mandated quality control/assurance?"

Moodle is an Australian development, it meets the rather rigorous Australian standards easily. There is a team of people who live and work in Perth and other places around the world that have a vested interest in making sure that Moodle meets all such standards from every country. The accessibility options, for example, are better than many other similar products. Most TAFE's use Moodle, most State education departments have been promoting Moodle as a LMS, I understand that more than half the Oz universities are now implementing Moodle. So I suggest that yes, Moodle does that and more.

"What about integration with student management type software such as VetTrak? "   

If VetTrak, is a PHP based application, and I do not know, then it is a simple matter of creating your own APIs, if you have the skill base to do it. However, you answer your own question.. "The software developers have said that there is facility for that from their end (via an API which has to be purchased separately)."  As TAFEs already use Moodle and I seem to recall hearing that a few were using earlier versions of VetTrak, it should already be done. (It has been over a decade since I left TAFE so I am not sure what they do these days.) So the key from VetTrak's view is "if you want it, pay for it and we will give it to you".

BTW, anyone thinking that there is too much regulation here in overseeing the training sector, please realize that where there is money to be made, the sharks will gather and corruption will grow. The introduction of a lot of this regulation wiped out the serious sharks pretty quickly and we can say that training in this country is getting better because of it. Qualifications actually mean something and not just in Oz.

In reply to Colin Fraser

Re: Clarification on Moodle features

by Marcus Green -
Picture of Core developers Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers

You certainly can store them on the disks for that amount of time. Being able to read them 30 years later may be a challenge however. See the following links

http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/dvd-authoring/57995-shelf-life-burned-pressed-dvds.html

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-13367398

But none of that information is Moodle related it is all about archiving technology which is a discipline in its own right.

In reply to Marcus Green

Re: Clarification on Moodle features

by Jeremy Davis -

Thanks Marcus,

As I say below, I don't currently plan to use disks, but thanks for the links anyway! smile

In reply to Colin Fraser

Re: Clarification on Moodle features

by Jeremy Davis -

Firstly, thank you so much for response Colin.

"Jeremy, you understand how ludicrous that requirement is don't you. Apart from the obvious space requirements, how many RTOs are going to be able to survive that long?  Agghhh another argument I lost... damnit."

Yep, but that's what we have to work with...! The main driving force for us to go electronic is purely because of the physical space requirements of paper records (we already have a room full of stacked filing cabinets and realisticly at the rate we are going we will need to hire new premises just for archiving).

"yes, Moodle backups can be stored on discs for the required time. Whether the technology will be available to read them is a completely different question."

Currently we don't have plans to burn data to disk. At this stage our intention is to maintain the data in multiple data backups: 2 onsite using HDD & 2 offsite.

"Are RTOs required to maintain the old technologies just to be able to read them or will the RTOs be constantly upgrading their archives to new technology standards to make sure that compatibility issues do not prevent access to that material to meet that expectation?"

My understanding is that there is a requirement to take 'reasonable steps' to make sure that the data is maintained, available and accessable for the 30 year period. So I guess that is still open to some degree of interpretation. That is one of my main reasons for wanting to use open source technologies. At least there would be possibility of hiring someone to extract the relevant data.

[re versioning of materials] "So I suggest that yes, Moodle does that and more."

Cool! But sounds like I'll need to have a play around and more in depth read of the documentation because I haven't been able to find any details about the specifics of that (eg how to output a diff).

[re VetTrak integration] "So the key from VetTrak's view is "if you want it, pay for it and we will give it to you"."

Yep, that's what I was afraid of... VetTrak seems like ok software but being an open source enthusiast it seems like everytime you want to do just one more little thing it costs you another $x upfront and ongoing extra $y per year. I have no issue paying for one or the other, but it seems rude to me to have to pay for both... Although I will admit that their support is fantastic.

"BTW, anyone thinking that there is too much regulation here in overseeing the training sector, please realize that where there is money to be made, the sharks will gather and corruption will grow. The introduction of a lot of this regulation wiped out the serious sharks pretty quickly and we can say that training in this country is getting better because of it. Qualifications actually mean something and not just in Oz."

Well put! You are absolutely right. There is a lot of money to be made and with the level of competition emerging it is clear that some providers would cut corners were there not the level of accountability required. And like you say, the quals are actually worth something and isn't that the point of training!?

Thanks again for your relevant and helpful input.

In reply to Jeremy Davis

Re: Clarification on Moodle features

by Adi Tedjasaputra -

Hi Jeremy,

I am based in Australia, so I am well aware of your requirements. I could say that each of them is technically possible. With regards to stories, you may want to follow the links in the following blog post: http://emania.org/?p=343

You may also want to attend Moodlemoot AU 2012 - http://moodlemoot.org.au/ to learn more from others who have implemented your requirements in OZ.

In reply to Adi Tedjasaputra

Re: Clarification on Moodle features

by Jeremy Davis -

Thanks for your input Adi,

That sounds promising. Thanks for the blog link. That will provide me with a bit of reading...

And Moodlemoot AU 2012 would be awesome. Unfortunately I doubt the boss will pay for me to go unless we commit to Moodle by then, but from where I'm sitting Moodle seems like a no brainer! smile