Problems using progressive download media with url flips

Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Andrea Bicciolo -
Number of replies: 22

I'm testing the use of resources made by multimedia files (windows media, real media with audio and/or video) with embedded URL flips.

Generally this multimedia files are embedded into an HTML page composed by two frames, one frames host the multimedia file (by browser plugin) and the other shows the pages flipped. Flipping occurs by calls from within the multimedia file. The files are working and tested from an http server.

Now i've uploaded all the files tested into the course file space (outside the web space) as .zip, then uncompressed. Attached there is a snapshot of the files uploaded and unzipped inside the course file space.

A resource has been created as "file on this server": the multimedia file, called from the html page by the use of a redirector file (a03.wvx in the snapshot, it is used to inform the browser plugin about the name and location of the multimedia file. In this case, it contains just the name of the multimedia files since it is in the same folder), is not found, so nothing works.

Any opinion/suggestion about this issue from the community is greatly appreciated.

Attachment urlflip.gif
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In reply to Andrea Bicciolo

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Martin Dougiamas -
Picture of Core developers Picture of Documentation writers Picture of Moodle HQ Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers
Firstly, you need slasharguments turned on in the Moodle config.

Secondly, you'll need to have Moodle 1.3 at least, because it contains a fix from Bernard in file.php that allows arguments to be passed to Moodle files.

Hope one of these is the answer!
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In reply to Martin Dougiamas

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Andrea Bicciolo -

Martin, thanks for your prompt response. Yes, slashargument is turned on and I tested on latest CVS, 1.4 development, RedHat 9, Apache 1.3.29.

I'll try on Debian, Apache2 with 1.3.1 stable,  production.

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In reply to Andrea Bicciolo

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Martin Dougiamas -
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Another guess ... turn off the setting to "filter external files" in Admin -> Config -> Filters
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In reply to Martin Dougiamas

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Andrea Bicciolo -

Tested also on Debian, the same. Also tried to turn off The filter, no solution. If anyone intersetd in making some tries I can upload the .zip files on a server for download.

Opening the windows media plugin contextual menu "Error details", the error seems to be about the file location: "unable to open the file, Check path or file name". Maybe the plugin works bad when the redirector file is outside a web space.

In the meantime, I made another test: I've pointed directly to the media file instead of the redirector file, and the problem persists.

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In reply to Martin Dougiamas

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Andrea Bicciolo -

After several test in the same arena I found also a problem with the use of  Flash "loadMovie" when target movie is a .jpg instead of a .swf.  I'm further indagating.

If anyone is interested in testing the problem I posted about windows media and redirector file, here is a package for download. Upload into a course, unzip and link as resource file. Direct entry point is /a/a03fset.htm, otherwise index.htm.

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In reply to Andrea Bicciolo

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Martin Dougiamas -
Picture of Core developers Picture of Documentation writers Picture of Moodle HQ Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers
Sorry about the delay, Andrea ... I'm looking into this today.
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In reply to Martin Dougiamas

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Martin Dougiamas -
Picture of Core developers Picture of Documentation writers Picture of Moodle HQ Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers
Andrea, this seems to be working fine for me (at least technically wink wink ), unless I'm missing out on what it's supposed to do. I see a guy talking in a video on the left, and JPEG slides coming up on the right.

http://moodle.org/file.php/1/testurlsync/a/a03fset.htm
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In reply to Martin Dougiamas

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Andrea Bicciolo -

Hi Martin, thank you for testing. I'm happy to know the solution is very close. The video guy should talk on the left side and the (ugly) jpg slides should appear on the right. I tested your link and I also see the video coming up but the slides opens on a new window. Two questions:

How do you uploaded and linked the resource? I uploaded as .zip, unzipped then linked the a03fset.htm as "uploaded file". Then I tested to show the file both with the navigation frameset on the top and with the popup window. My link for the resource is:

http://192.168.1.11/moodle/mod/resource/view.php?id=183 and totally differs from your.

Do you see the video and the slides in the same browser window?

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In reply to Andrea Bicciolo

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by W Page -
Hi Andrea,

I experienced the same thing you did when I went to Martin's link. I saw the following,
  • Someone speaking on the left
  • New Browser windows opening with slides on them.

It happenned with Mozilla Firefox .8 and IE6.

WP1
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In reply to W Page

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Andrea Bicciolo -

W, thanks for testing. I tested with IE6 only. I just wonder if there is a possibility to work around the recent IE6 patch that prevents the use of  http://username:password@www.myserver.com, thus disallowing de facto the ability to protect entire folder and subfolders with a simple .htaccess: I imagine a solution that allows to enter userid/password when entering web link resources and then, if the userid/password exist, post them via php along with the url. Unsure if it can work, i made some test but with IE i get a blank page when attempting to post  http://username:password@www.myserver.com by php.

Why I talk about this? Because if the .htaccess basic athentication could be used, the problem on subject would be easily solved. Otherwise I can protect .html pages converting them into .php but I can't protect media files when uploaded into web space.

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In reply to Andrea Bicciolo

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Martin Dougiamas -
Picture of Core developers Picture of Documentation writers Picture of Moodle HQ Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers
Under Mozilla it works fine for me ... but on IE I get the popup windows too.

I'm pretty sure there's a HTML problem in there but I haven't had a look yet.
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In reply to Martin Dougiamas

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Andrea Bicciolo -

I have mode some other test about the subject, and going on the direction pointed by Martin, I was able to create a repeating behaviour, but the problem still persits even if i feel the solution very close:

Case 1. if the files are uploaded as "site file" from within the Moodle front page course and accessed as "web page resource" using the syntax http://yoursite/moodle/file.php/1/afolder/yourframeset.html, the progressive download media works fine in main browser window, popup window and framed window and synching works pretty well with no display problem. The same works perfectly from within any course that access the site files as "web page resource" using the same syntax shown above. But with such configuration and site setting forcelogin=no any people can access and see the files without login.

Case 2. If the files are uploaded within any course different form the front page course and accessed as "web page resource" using the same syntax above but with the course id in the path (for example, http://yoursite/moodle/file.php/2/afolder/yourframeset.html, note the only difference in the syntax is the course id) the html files are correctly displayed (main browser, popup, framed) but the progressive download media file does not start at all.

Case 3. If Case 1 above is tested with site setting forcelogin=yes, also the working syntax http://yoursite/moodle/file.php/1/afolder/yourframeset.html stop working and behave like Case 2.

The problem seems to be related to the need of a login. When login is not needed, Moodle is perfecty able to serve synchronized progressive download media from outside the web space in a browser window (main, popup or framed)  smile.  When a login is needed, something behave differently  sad: html frameset and files are correctly displayed but the progressive media does not start at all, showing the error "unable to open file, check path or file name"

The question is: what could affect Moodle's file.php behaviour (in the scenario indicated in this thread) on media files when a login is needed?

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In reply to Andrea Bicciolo

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Andrea Bicciolo -
Just an addendum in the case my yesterday post could be of interest of anyone: the test suite was made in 1.4 development.
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In reply to Andrea Bicciolo

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Martin Dougiamas -
Picture of Core developers Picture of Documentation writers Picture of Moodle HQ Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers
Aha! Yes, I see - the video is not working this way.

http://moodle.org/file.php/5/testurlsync/a/a03fset.htm

I think the problem is Windows Media Player itself.

Normally, the browser is logged in, and every request to the site (any session-based site, not just Moodle) sends a session cookie back to the server, which is how a session appears seamless.

The problem here is that the browser spots the embedded media, then calls Media Player to play it. Media Player doesn't appear to be sending the same cookies (so Moodle tells it to log in - though we never see this - and Media Player just fails).

To prove this, here is the same file displayed from this course using the mediaplugin filter

And again from the site folder The second one should be working while the first does not. Unfortunately, this appears to be a bug in the Windows Media Player implementation... there's not much we can do except for disabling login protection on certain file types (which would not be a good idea in general).   As a hack to get things working for your site you could just comment out the two lines in file.php that contain require_login().  Just prepend them with //.
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In reply to Martin Dougiamas

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Martin Dougiamas -
Picture of Core developers Picture of Documentation writers Picture of Moodle HQ Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers

Actually, I just tried this using IE 6 and WMP10 and BOTH of them work!

In Mozilla, using the older WMP plugin only the second one works.

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In reply to Martin Dougiamas

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Andrea Bicciolo -

Hi Martin, thanks for taking the time to look at this problem. The require_login() hack I'm not sure is suitable, since I want login. Good news that IE6 and WMP10 solve the problem, even if wmp10 may not be so ubiquitous yet.

Just wondering if using realmedia files could solve the problem. I'll made other test using this type of media and i'll post the result here.

For information: i was able to see both files linked from your post, but only as WMP popup. No one played from within the web forum page. (tested using WMP 8).

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In reply to Martin Dougiamas

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Andrea Bicciolo -

testing testing testing, a little light become to be visible smile. According to Martin's consideration

**"The problem here is that the browser spots the embedded media, then calls Media Player to play it. Media Player doesn't appear to be sending the same cookies (so Moodle tells it to log in - though we never see this - and Media Player just fails)."**

I tried to find a workaround letting the player to be considered "logged in", and I made it changing the redirector file (.wmx or .rpm, depending on media file), from relative to absolute through "file.php" functions wich already is aware of logged in users::

Test suite:

  • WinXp, RealPlayer8: OK
  • Win2000,RealPlayer8: OK
  • WinXP, WindowsMedia 8: FAIL
  • Win2000, WinMedia9: OK

The approach seems works better with Realmedia file and RealPlayer. In this way the URL sync with flips works, media download progressively and a login is requested to access the resource. Would be of interest testing in mozilla/realplayer and higher realplayer versions, anyone?

On the counterpart the redirector files become server dependent, but I think it is a little price to be paid compared to the benefits.

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In reply to Andrea Bicciolo

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Wen Hao Chuang -

I have a related problem. I created a process to generate SMIL (The Synchronized Multimedia Integration Language), but just found out that the current Moodle media-plug-in does not recognize SMIL files... is there any way to fix it?

I'm thinking of using SMIL to sync PowerPoint files (converted to JPEG files) with the QuickTime movie (or RealMedia videos), instead of using the current Quicktim HREF Tracks... would this be a better approach (to integrate with Moodle), for live or archived "video" presentation (sync with sliced JPEG version of PowerPoint)?? Thanks!

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In reply to Wen Hao Chuang

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Martin Dougiamas -
Picture of Core developers Picture of Documentation writers Picture of Moodle HQ Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Plugin developers Picture of Testers
SMIL is good.  Can you please send me some sample SMIL files to play with?
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In reply to Martin Dougiamas

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Wen Hao Chuang -

Sure, Martin, here is a sample file that we created for a "sync-ed" PowerPoint presentation with a talking head streaming video (in Real Media .rm format):

<smil>
 <head>
  <meta name="title" content="Media Test" />
  <meta name="author" content="Wen" />
  <meta name="copyright" content="(c) 2004 Wen" />
  
  <layout>
   <!-- The root-layout sets the height and width of the entire presentation
    in pixels.  Each region sets specific areas in the presentation
    that media will play to -->
   
   <root-layout width="860" height="353" bgcolor="black"/>

   <region id="video_region"  width="240" height="180" left="0" top="0" />
   <region id="glossary_region"  width="240" height="135" left="0" top="200"  />
   <region id="glossarytitle_region"width="240" height="18" left="0" top="180" />  

   <region id="images_region"  width="470" height="353" left="240" top="0" />
   <region id="text_region"  width="150" height="352" left="710" top="0" />
  
   <region id="quiz_region"  width="240" height="10" left="0" top="343"  />
  </layout>
 </head>
 
 <body>
  <!-- Each line between the <par></par> tags is a media file which will play to a
   specified region.  The <par> tags mean that they will play at the same
   time (in parallel).  Fill="freeze" means that the final frame will stay
   visible when that media file is done.  -->
  

  <par>

   <video src="lecture 1.rm" region="video_region" begin="1s" />
   <text src="glossary.rt" region="glossary_region" begin="1s" />
   
 
   <img src="powerpoint.rp" region="images_region" begin="1s" />
   <text src="index.rt" region="text_region" begin="1s" />

   <text src="glossarytitle.rt" region="glossarytitle_region" begin="1s" />
   <text src="quiz.rt" region="quiz_region" begin="1s" />
  </par>
 </body>
</smil>

By the way, I will send you another email so that you could access other files...

Thanks!

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In reply to Andrea Bicciolo

Re: Problems using progressive download media with url flips

by Jon Altschuler -
I was having this problem and luckily came across this thread.
I was originally using Windows Media Video and decided to try Flash Video instead. Lo and behold it works like a champ!
While this is good to know, I would like to find a way to use Windows Media as well. If anyone has figured this out, I sure would like to know how.

Thanks and keep up the good work!

Jon
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