Hello all
We have all the quizzes in secure window. Now we saw, that you can make a print screen of the question with firefox.
With internet explorer this is no problem. But if you can make print screens with firefox, the questions can be copied.
Does anybody know a solution to solve this. We are using Moodle 1.7.3
Need help urgently. Thanks to all who can help
Greets
Mark
In reply to mark furrer
Re: Urgent: Print Screen in Firefox: Quiz in secure Window
by Howard Miller -
The trouble is that secure mode only makes sense in a completely locked down environment that you control. If it isn't you have no chance of securing the questions. So you fix the Firefox problem; then what about Opera? What about Lynx, Safari, Omniweb, Konqueror..... you see what I mean?
In reply to Howard Miller
Re: Urgent: Print Screen in Firefox: Quiz in secure Window
by mark furrer -
Hi Howard
You are right. As we have distance learners we cannot control the browser the user has. But I need a solution for Firefox. Then I have covered the most common browsers. IE and Firefox.
Is there any solution? Or is it a big problem?
Greets Mark
You are right. As we have distance learners we cannot control the browser the user has. But I need a solution for Firefox. Then I have covered the most common browsers. IE and Firefox.
Is there any solution? Or is it a big problem?
Greets Mark
In reply to Howard Miller
Re: Urgent: Print Screen in Firefox: Quiz in secure Window
by Marcus Green -
I have been responding to questions about making material secure/uncopiable for several years and no matter how you spin it you cannot reliably prevent the copying of questions/material. Assuming you have at least one student of moderate curiosity and ingenuity there will be the ability to copy. If you don't want material copied, do not make it visible from a web browser. Copying is not a technical issue it is a human issue.
In reply to mark furrer
Re: Urgent: Print Screen in Firefox: Quiz in secure Window
by Joseph Rézeau -
Hi Mark,
Screens can be copied. The quiz questions can be copied. So what?
May I just say (once again) that the belief that quiz taking in an internet browser can be made "secure" is a total delusion.
Now please examine the following scenario. For an exam you give a paper quiz to students in class A. Student Johnny somehow manages to get an extra blank copy of that paper quiz. After taking the quiz, he gives that copy to his friend Mary, in class B, who looks up the answers in the course documents. The next day you give the same paper quiz to class B. Mary has prepared all the correct answers and through "cheating" gets 100% on the quiz. Would you then protest that paper-based quizzes make cheating too easy?
Please also see these discussions:
Joseph
In reply to Joseph Rézeau
Re: Urgent: Print Screen in Firefox: Quiz in secure Window
by mark furrer -
Hi Joseph
Thanks for replying. We have bought a licence which contains questions. The licence contains that the questions can not be copied by print screen (in the common browsers IE and Firefox). Hence it is very important for us to disable print screen. Mouse right klick is not a problem, printscreen with firefox.
Greets Mark
Thanks for replying. We have bought a licence which contains questions. The licence contains that the questions can not be copied by print screen (in the common browsers IE and Firefox). Hence it is very important for us to disable print screen. Mouse right klick is not a problem, printscreen with firefox.
Greets Mark
In reply to mark furrer
Re: Urgent: Print Screen in Firefox: Quiz in secure Window
by Joseph Rézeau -
Mark > We have bought a licence which contains questions.
I have no idea what this means...
Joseph
In reply to Joseph Rézeau
Re: Urgent: Print Screen in Firefox: Quiz in secure Window
by mark furrer -
Hello Joseph
Mark > We have bought a licence which contains questions.
This is not important. I only look for a solution, how to disable print screen in firefox.
Is there no script which I can use to disable the printscreen?
Greets Mark
Mark > We have bought a licence which contains questions.
This is not important. I only look for a solution, how to disable print screen in firefox.
Is there no script which I can use to disable the printscreen?
Greets Mark
In reply to mark furrer
Re: Urgent: Print Screen in Firefox: Quiz in secure Window
by Anthony Borrow -
Mark - Perhaps a way to cover yourself for the license - depending on the wording (and please note that I am not a lawyer) - but if you specifically make using the print screen button not allowed by your students in a quiz as part of the user agreement do you think that might cover you? My line of thinking is that the students can still write down a copy of the questions and make them into an electronic copy. To be honest, if I were a student looking to do this I would do it by hand rather than print screen because of the time needed to analyze the image and covert and then paste together the various images, etc. I'm not sure how to disable particular keystrokes. Could you do a little google research and report back what you find. It may be possible to develop a little patch to accomplish what you are hoping for. Peace - Anthony
In reply to Anthony Borrow
Re: Urgent: Print Screen in Firefox: Quiz in secure Window
by mark furrer -
Hello
I did some research and found a link on del.icio.us
http://blog.gilluminate.com/2006/4/25/prevent-copy-paste-and-print-screen-online
which contains:
As I am no programmer I don't know if this works and where to put it.
Is this a solution?
Greets Mark
I did some research and found a link on del.icio.us
http://blog.gilluminate.com/2006/4/25/prevent-copy-paste-and-print-screen-online
which contains:
"Then I remembered an Adobe Flash (that still sounds weird, doesn't it?) application that I worked on a few years ago that used Flash's built in clipboard functions. Booya! I cranked up Flash and wrote the following simple and very easy actionscript in the first line of the first frame:
this.onEnterFrame = function(){
System.setClipboard("As long as this page is open your copy/paste functionality has been disabled.");
}
(Added 08/28/2007: for the new CS3 use
addEventListener(Event.ENTER_FRAME, onEnterFrame);
function onEnterFrame(E){
System.setClipboard("As long as this page is open your copy/paste functionality has been disabled.");
}
As I am no programmer I don't know if this works and where to put it.
Is this a solution?
Greets Mark
Hello all
Or this one:
<script language="JavaScript" type="text/JavaScript"> <!-- document.attachEvent("onkeydown", my_onkeydown_handler); function my_onkeydown_handler(){ switch (event.keyCode) { case 122 : // 'F11' event.returnValue = false; event.keyCode = 0; break; } } //--> </script>
comming from
http://www.sitepoint.com/forums/showthread.php?t=136801&page=2&pp=25
But where to place it?
Greets Mark
Or this one:
<script language="JavaScript" type="text/JavaScript"> <!-- document.attachEvent("onkeydown", my_onkeydown_handler); function my_onkeydown_handler(){ switch (event.keyCode) { case 122 : // 'F11' event.returnValue = false; event.keyCode = 0; break; } } //--> </script>
comming from
http://www.sitepoint.com/forums/showthread.php?t=136801&page=2&pp=25
But where to place it?
Greets Mark
In reply to mark furrer
Re: Urgent: Print Screen in Firefox: Quiz in secure Window
by Howard Miller -
I read that link - it's *really* stupid. . He makes a huge list of assumptions about - effectively - the lack of intelligence of his users and a quite particular machine setup - which he could, as he was talking about files on a company intranet.
I *loved* his opening comment, that he assumed that his users would not know about "print screen" or "save as". That was funny
I *loved* his opening comment, that he assumed that his users would not know about "print screen" or "save as". That was funny
In reply to mark furrer
Re: Urgent: Print Screen in Firefox: Quiz in secure Window
by Howard Miller -
Mark,
Let's get to the point - you *cannot* lock down content that comes over the web. You *cannot* fulfill the terms of that license. I'm sorry to be the bringer of bad news, but that is the reality. If something is delivered over the web then it can be copied.
It's not something I like to say, but if you need a very secure quiz delivery environment then web delivery in general and Moodle in particular is not the solution.
Printscreen, for example, is part of the operating system. What if someone is running on a Mac? Any solution that you come up with will almost certainly be trivial to circumvent by anybody who can work Google. If there is a strong interest in getting hold of the questions, then somebody will (ie, if its is some sort of professional qualification, or it costs money).
I'm sorry if I sound like I'm lecturing you, but this question comes up (in one form or another) again and again. The question of delivering secure assessment over the web is important and a huge technical challenge, but you are taking the wrong approach trying to solve it. The only real answer is a huge question bank of randomly delivered questions such that "stealing" the questions doesn't really do you any good.
Let's get to the point - you *cannot* lock down content that comes over the web. You *cannot* fulfill the terms of that license. I'm sorry to be the bringer of bad news, but that is the reality. If something is delivered over the web then it can be copied.
It's not something I like to say, but if you need a very secure quiz delivery environment then web delivery in general and Moodle in particular is not the solution.
Printscreen, for example, is part of the operating system. What if someone is running on a Mac? Any solution that you come up with will almost certainly be trivial to circumvent by anybody who can work Google. If there is a strong interest in getting hold of the questions, then somebody will (ie, if its is some sort of professional qualification, or it costs money).
I'm sorry if I sound like I'm lecturing you, but this question comes up (in one form or another) again and again. The question of delivering secure assessment over the web is important and a huge technical challenge, but you are taking the wrong approach trying to solve it. The only real answer is a huge question bank of randomly delivered questions such that "stealing" the questions doesn't really do you any good.
In reply to Howard Miller
Re: Urgent: Print Screen in Firefox: Quiz in secure Window
by mark furrer -
Howard
Thank you for going straight to the point. There is no solution as it seems.
I never wanted to have a solution to secure the whole content which comes over the web
. I looked only for a solution to disable print screen with firefox as there is with moodle and IE. And I thought perhaps somebody knows or can help.
Thanks Mark
Thank you for going straight to the point. There is no solution as it seems.
I never wanted to have a solution to secure the whole content which comes over the web
Thanks Mark
In reply to mark furrer
Re: Urgent: Print Screen in Firefox: Quiz in secure Window
by Howard Miller -
You can't disable print-screen with IE on an open users machine either. You can make it more difficult, but that certainly isn't the same thing. If you leave loop holes in your security and there is a good reason to find them, users *will* find them. If there is no good reason then there was no point trying to secure the content in the first place.
I hope you find a method to host your quizzes. Perhaps you can share more fully what you want to do and what your problems are. We might just be able to help
I hope you find a method to host your quizzes. Perhaps you can share more fully what you want to do and what your problems are. We might just be able to help
In reply to Howard Miller
Re: Urgent: Print Screen in Firefox: Quiz in secure Window
by mark furrer -
Hi Howard
Ok, perhaps I was a bit misunderstood or I took the wrong words. In your words I would like to make print screen a bit more difficult with firefox. Hence I don't want to disable print screen. What I see is with IE and moodle it is a bit more difficult to make print screen and I am asking myself, if there is a similar solution with firefox and moodle?
Greets Mark
Ok, perhaps I was a bit misunderstood or I took the wrong words. In your words I would like to make print screen a bit more difficult with firefox. Hence I don't want to disable print screen. What I see is with IE and moodle it is a bit more difficult to make print screen and I am asking myself, if there is a similar solution with firefox and moodle?
Greets Mark
In reply to mark furrer
Re: Urgent: Print Screen in Firefox: Quiz in secure Window
by Mauno Korpelainen -
Mark,
I agree all those words that others have told you - this is really like playing cat and mouse...still you have several ways to TRY to make copying more difficult...
The basic idea of those methods is not to cancel print screen but to write some script that changes the content of clipboard faster than any person (or computer) can enter print screen and paste it to some program. It can be placed to file mod/quiz/protect_js.php (header script) or mod/quiz/attempt.php before footer tags for example. But no cross browser compatible script does not exist.
IF visitors had always flash plugin installed that flash example COULD work - in IE and FF but not in Opera and Safari. IF visitors had (or were forced to have) javascript enabled the current secure Window script or some other script that changes clipboard content works for "normal" visitors with IE and you might be able to write a similar script with help of http://developer.mozilla.org/en/docs/Using_the_Clipboard - and again it would not work in Opera or Safari.
But: IF you really need to do it you may also prevent using certain browsers for your quizzes with a couple of lines of code using browser check. You could just allow those people to answer who have IE and tell others to use IE to be able to answer your quiz...although some (few) cheaters will always find a way to copy questions (at least with paper and pencil)
In reply to Mauno Korpelainen
Re: Urgent: Print Screen in Firefox: Quiz in secure Window
by ArVee Gee -
I agree on disabling "print screen" as well if possible.
In addition to this, it is advisable to use only one browser into which "print screen" can be disabled i.e. IE or FF whatsoever. If they want to copy the questions, the only way to do it is to use pencil and paper. But if the quiz is using timer, I don't think so they still have the time to copy it and for sure they will fail gonna fail the quiz.
... and then there are those who would photograph the screen w/their cellphones. There are more than two edges to the technology sword.
In reply to Mauno Korpelainen
Re: Urgent: Print Screen in Firefox: Quiz in secure Window
by Howard Miller -
Several browsers have a facility to "impersonate" other browsers of course.
I'm probably sounding boring/pedantic, but the thing that troubles me is that I often feel that the underlying reasons for wanting to do this sort of thing in the first place are often flawed.
I'm probably sounding boring/pedantic, but the thing that troubles me is that I often feel that the underlying reasons for wanting to do this sort of thing in the first place are often flawed.