Been thinking about Moodle's potential as the next Facebook. Turns out, "that guy who did that Web 2.0 video" Michael Wesch has been thinking about similar issues.
My own take is that it can be the best of two worlds.
So, is this just an anthro thing or are others thinking along the same lines?
Moodle as New Facebook
Number of replies: 32Re: Moodle as New Facebook
I would guess that the Moodle Network functionality that's coming in 1.8 would be a great help in setting up something like this.
Re: Moodle as New Facebook
Tony,
Thanks a lot for the notice. As a mere Moodle teacher (i.e., non-admin), I haven't been following those developments very closely. It does sound like Moodle Network will bring Moodle closer to my ideal solution. Especially if Moodle Network works like OpenID.
As it turns out, Michael Penney sent an elaborate comment on my blog about Moodle's upcoming Facebook-like features. I still need to wrap my head around what a social networking features in Moodle would look like, but I'm quite glad that people are taking it up. I really do see a lot of potential, there.
To brainstorm a bit more, without thinking too much about the technical details.
Each member (teacher, student, administrator) of each Moodle installation (each campus, say) has an ID which can work on any Moodle installation. Hopefully, PeopleSoft/SIS integration isn't an issue. People can have multiple roles in multiple groups, some of which are really networks of "friends" (in the MySpace/Facebook sense) while others are actual courses. A person's main page is easy to use and can serve all at the same time as a public blog, a portal, a "comment wall," a profile, a host for "user-generated content," and an eLearning solution. For students, feedback on assignments for different courses is aggregated. Teachers can communicate about students across different courses. Anyone can post blog entries using third-party tools and those entries can be sent to specific groups or displayed publicly. Blocks in a user's main page can be moved around and customised, using some easy-to-understand AJAX technology as in Google Page Creator, WordPress.com's Sidebar Widgets, or Blogger Beta. Different templates are available but can easily be customised by users through both GUI and code. Users can "borrow" content from one another while maintaining links and Creative Commons licenses. Large files are distributed through peer-to-peer technology. Server administrators can limit bandwidths for different groups and individuals. Podcasts are P2Ped. Different file formats can be viewed directly in a page: PDF, MP3, MPEG, RTF, Word, PPT... Content can easily be repurposed from, say, OPML to PPT and hosted HTML. Teams can be setup by users themselves or by people with specific roles (such as a teacher). Public pages could serve as centralised profiles. Activities from other users recognised as "friends" are automatically aggregated, depending on the level of "trust" allowed by users themselves. Specific Skype- or ICQ-like icons for "I am available for discussion" would appear in the list of "friends." People's calendars could be aggregated (upcoming shows, teamwork, etc.). Different kinds of content (blog entries, assignments, etc.) could be sent from an email account, a phone, etc. ID pictures would be the default picture instead of the yellow happy face. Current items (weeks or topics) from different courses would be aggregated. Notification of private messages would appear as a mailbox icon instead of a popup window. Users could set the level of privacy for their Moodle activities. Browser toolbars would ease things like collecting images and links. The "insert link" button would communicate with a type of browser history function (maybe through a del.ico.us-like or Spurl-like feature) to list possible links to insert. Content submission (blog entries, assignments...) would be confirmed, with a list of links to a user's submitted content, with timestamps and versions. All content available to a user could be searched through a simple interface. A private Sakai-like filemanager would make Moodle the ideal way to back up important files. A user's connection to former groups (classes, etc.) would be maintained. Alumni could keep their Moodle account even if they lose the email privilege at the institution (maybe through a third-party host which would still maintain the links).
Whew! I know some of these things sound completely absurd while others are already doable. Just thinking out loud (or brainstorming with myself).
Thanks a lot!
Thanks a lot for the notice. As a mere Moodle teacher (i.e., non-admin), I haven't been following those developments very closely. It does sound like Moodle Network will bring Moodle closer to my ideal solution. Especially if Moodle Network works like OpenID.
As it turns out, Michael Penney sent an elaborate comment on my blog about Moodle's upcoming Facebook-like features. I still need to wrap my head around what a social networking features in Moodle would look like, but I'm quite glad that people are taking it up. I really do see a lot of potential, there.
To brainstorm a bit more, without thinking too much about the technical details.
Each member (teacher, student, administrator) of each Moodle installation (each campus, say) has an ID which can work on any Moodle installation. Hopefully, PeopleSoft/SIS integration isn't an issue. People can have multiple roles in multiple groups, some of which are really networks of "friends" (in the MySpace/Facebook sense) while others are actual courses. A person's main page is easy to use and can serve all at the same time as a public blog, a portal, a "comment wall," a profile, a host for "user-generated content," and an eLearning solution. For students, feedback on assignments for different courses is aggregated. Teachers can communicate about students across different courses. Anyone can post blog entries using third-party tools and those entries can be sent to specific groups or displayed publicly. Blocks in a user's main page can be moved around and customised, using some easy-to-understand AJAX technology as in Google Page Creator, WordPress.com's Sidebar Widgets, or Blogger Beta. Different templates are available but can easily be customised by users through both GUI and code. Users can "borrow" content from one another while maintaining links and Creative Commons licenses. Large files are distributed through peer-to-peer technology. Server administrators can limit bandwidths for different groups and individuals. Podcasts are P2Ped. Different file formats can be viewed directly in a page: PDF, MP3, MPEG, RTF, Word, PPT... Content can easily be repurposed from, say, OPML to PPT and hosted HTML. Teams can be setup by users themselves or by people with specific roles (such as a teacher). Public pages could serve as centralised profiles. Activities from other users recognised as "friends" are automatically aggregated, depending on the level of "trust" allowed by users themselves. Specific Skype- or ICQ-like icons for "I am available for discussion" would appear in the list of "friends." People's calendars could be aggregated (upcoming shows, teamwork, etc.). Different kinds of content (blog entries, assignments, etc.) could be sent from an email account, a phone, etc. ID pictures would be the default picture instead of the yellow happy face. Current items (weeks or topics) from different courses would be aggregated. Notification of private messages would appear as a mailbox icon instead of a popup window. Users could set the level of privacy for their Moodle activities. Browser toolbars would ease things like collecting images and links. The "insert link" button would communicate with a type of browser history function (maybe through a del.ico.us-like or Spurl-like feature) to list possible links to insert. Content submission (blog entries, assignments...) would be confirmed, with a list of links to a user's submitted content, with timestamps and versions. All content available to a user could be searched through a simple interface. A private Sakai-like filemanager would make Moodle the ideal way to back up important files. A user's connection to former groups (classes, etc.) would be maintained. Alumni could keep their Moodle account even if they lose the email privilege at the institution (maybe through a third-party host which would still maintain the links).
Whew! I know some of these things sound completely absurd while others are already doable. Just thinking out loud (or brainstorming with myself).
Thanks a lot!
Re: Moodle as New Facebook
The Explode widget that the Elgg guys have been working on looks interesting. It lets you connect friends who are on different social networks (and this is starting to be a big problem.... everybody is rolling out a social network these days). A bonus is that it gives you an OpenID.
Re: Moodle as New Facebook
Tony,
Excellent point. When I first saw Explode (thanks to Frances, actually), I first thought "this is it!"
I do tend to be overly enthusiastic about new technological ideas. I then tend to change my tune when I look at the details. In this case, I do see Explode as a partial solution to the proliferation of social-networking sites. And OpenID is either the way to go or, at least, the right idea. But I still see a different type of integration.
Maybe Moodle content should "simply" be sent to a unified social networking solution. Something like a reincarnation of the "portal" idea, but geared toward a person's social networks (including a teacher or student's campus community). Certainly, RSS-based aggregation can go in that direction.
One obvious issue with Elgg's Explode is that it doesn't accept OpenIDs from the outside and some say that it is unlikely that there will be support for external OpenIDs in the near future. WordPress.com just rolled out its own OpenID implementation and since my main blog is on enkerli.wordpress.com (an easy to use and remember URI), I wish I could use WP as my OpenID everywhere...
Another issue is that, though it can help link people across networks, it doesn't help that much in integrating all the features of all of those social networking solutions.
Maybe I'm not thinking about this the right way. But I do see a future for an elegant, integrated solution to eLearning, content-distribution (including blogs), and social-networking.
Excellent point. When I first saw Explode (thanks to Frances, actually), I first thought "this is it!"
I do tend to be overly enthusiastic about new technological ideas. I then tend to change my tune when I look at the details. In this case, I do see Explode as a partial solution to the proliferation of social-networking sites. And OpenID is either the way to go or, at least, the right idea. But I still see a different type of integration.
Maybe Moodle content should "simply" be sent to a unified social networking solution. Something like a reincarnation of the "portal" idea, but geared toward a person's social networks (including a teacher or student's campus community). Certainly, RSS-based aggregation can go in that direction.
One obvious issue with Elgg's Explode is that it doesn't accept OpenIDs from the outside and some say that it is unlikely that there will be support for external OpenIDs in the near future. WordPress.com just rolled out its own OpenID implementation and since my main blog is on enkerli.wordpress.com (an easy to use and remember URI), I wish I could use WP as my OpenID everywhere...
Another issue is that, though it can help link people across networks, it doesn't help that much in integrating all the features of all of those social networking solutions.
Maybe I'm not thinking about this the right way. But I do see a future for an elegant, integrated solution to eLearning, content-distribution (including blogs), and social-networking.
Re: Moodle as New Facebook
What is Facebook? Where can I see it? How is a different interface concept from current Moodle incarnations?
Re: Moodle as New Facebook
Don,
First off, thanks for your comment on my main blog. I just posted an even weirder list of wishes on another blog.
Facebook.com is one of the more popular social networking systems around. It used to be restricted to specific campus-wide networks but opened up a number of months ago. Some see it as the "up and coming MySpace-killer" and it does have some advantages over MySpace. For one thing, the overall design is much better. And it really does focus on social networking features, such as "poking" and connecting through different relationships (co-workers, specific classes together, etc.).
Accounts are typically based on email addresses tied to specific network. Originally, a campus email address was the way to associate with that campus community. It is now possible to choose regional communities or workplace networks.
I haven't been using Facebook that much. I think I first got intrigued by it while listening to a podcast presentation about the dangers of sharing too much information online. It specifically used Facebook profiles which can, in fact, provide too much information about an individual. The presentation focused on the fact that university students are willing to share a lot more information about themselves than they probably should. There's very little information which Facebook would require to get an account but there's a whole of information people can add to their profiles. There's a potential danger of this in terms of employment, according to that presenter.
Still, the issue of controlling what information about ourselves is available online is an important one.
(Kind of unfortunate but I just canceled one of my Facebook accounts by adding the email address to my main profile. Turns out, one should add networks instead of creating different accounts. Ah, well...)
First off, thanks for your comment on my main blog. I just posted an even weirder list of wishes on another blog.
Facebook.com is one of the more popular social networking systems around. It used to be restricted to specific campus-wide networks but opened up a number of months ago. Some see it as the "up and coming MySpace-killer" and it does have some advantages over MySpace. For one thing, the overall design is much better. And it really does focus on social networking features, such as "poking" and connecting through different relationships (co-workers, specific classes together, etc.).
Accounts are typically based on email addresses tied to specific network. Originally, a campus email address was the way to associate with that campus community. It is now possible to choose regional communities or workplace networks.
I haven't been using Facebook that much. I think I first got intrigued by it while listening to a podcast presentation about the dangers of sharing too much information online. It specifically used Facebook profiles which can, in fact, provide too much information about an individual. The presentation focused on the fact that university students are willing to share a lot more information about themselves than they probably should. There's very little information which Facebook would require to get an account but there's a whole of information people can add to their profiles. There's a potential danger of this in terms of employment, according to that presenter.
Still, the issue of controlling what information about ourselves is available online is an important one.
(Kind of unfortunate but I just canceled one of my Facebook accounts by adding the email address to my main profile. Turns out, one should add networks instead of creating different accounts. Ah, well...)
Re: Moodle as New Facebook
Thanks for that Alexandre - I didn't know Facebook's antecedents.
Don, If you visit Facebook, you might find that students and faculty are there already forming a network around your institution but not as part of your institutional provision.
My forays into social networking technologies have been part of my journey of understanding, trying to make sense of the changing landscape. Danah Boyd was talking on her blog recently about networked publics (Facebook is one of those I think) . If we talk about blogs, wikis, etc. there can be a difference in student's experiences between a blog or Myspace in the public domain that they control (subject to service provider's constraints) and one in a classroom space that may only last for the period of the course, and be visible to whom the teacher decides. Obviously it doesn't have to be like that, but I think there are important questions to answer about privacy (as Alexandre says), ownership, identity, longevity, as well as finding out about functionality and interface aspects.
Don, If you visit Facebook, you might find that students and faculty are there already forming a network around your institution but not as part of your institutional provision.
My forays into social networking technologies have been part of my journey of understanding, trying to make sense of the changing landscape. Danah Boyd was talking on her blog recently about networked publics (Facebook is one of those I think) . If we talk about blogs, wikis, etc. there can be a difference in student's experiences between a blog or Myspace in the public domain that they control (subject to service provider's constraints) and one in a classroom space that may only last for the period of the course, and be visible to whom the teacher decides. Obviously it doesn't have to be like that, but I think there are important questions to answer about privacy (as Alexandre says), ownership, identity, longevity, as well as finding out about functionality and interface aspects.
Re: Moodle as New Facebook
I tend not to think about Sakai much (partly because my experience was a bit limited) but it does support very finely tuned control over how long content might be accessed. In this case, I like the idea of a student being able to transform a graded course assignment into publicly available content by "the flip of a switch." Especially if course sites can act as repositories for such material. To me, there's really no better way to bring the collaborative nature of the learning process to the forefront of online communication! 
What's funny is that I bumped into danah boyd's blog a few times but for different reasons, over the last few days. Maybe she has the answers to all my questions!
One thing I like about the concept of Moodle as Facebook is that it helps me think about content, access, knowledge, eLearning, expression, etc. all at the same time. In a way, it's probably just the effect of the Web 2.0 bandwagon as described by Michael Wesch.
What's funny is that I bumped into danah boyd's blog a few times but for different reasons, over the last few days. Maybe she has the answers to all my questions!
One thing I like about the concept of Moodle as Facebook is that it helps me think about content, access, knowledge, eLearning, expression, etc. all at the same time. In a way, it's probably just the effect of the Web 2.0 bandwagon as described by Michael Wesch.
Re: Moodle as New Facebook
Hi Alexandre, Tony, and Frances,
Thanks for the explanations! I am keenly watching how SNS (what Japanese call social networking services) is developing and how Moodle can integrate its models and insights. Actually, I am sure in two years, we won't be able to describe Moodle as "one" thing, but rather a slew of networks, mashups, ecologies and so forth.
How is current Moodle evolving in that direction? Alex mentioned...
"I like the idea of a student being able to transform a graded course assignment into publicly available content by "the flip of a switch."
In a primitive way, we are doing that now with the Project Module. It is a multi-activity module for handling student-created projects. The team at TAMK are now finishing up another extension to the Project Module called "Publish" which publishes the projects (that have been graded and peer-assessed/self-assessed) to an open site for viewing and commenting. It is teacher-switch-on-able but it would be conceivable to add a little switch for students to switch it on or off within their portfolio or on the published site. In addition, this year we are making a content repository which will integrate into this rich well of student projects. I am also curious to see how learners could automatically click a "publish to wiki" button when a project is done.
Thanks for the explanations! I am keenly watching how SNS (what Japanese call social networking services) is developing and how Moodle can integrate its models and insights. Actually, I am sure in two years, we won't be able to describe Moodle as "one" thing, but rather a slew of networks, mashups, ecologies and so forth.
How is current Moodle evolving in that direction? Alex mentioned...
"I like the idea of a student being able to transform a graded course assignment into publicly available content by "the flip of a switch."
In a primitive way, we are doing that now with the Project Module. It is a multi-activity module for handling student-created projects. The team at TAMK are now finishing up another extension to the Project Module called "Publish" which publishes the projects (that have been graded and peer-assessed/self-assessed) to an open site for viewing and commenting. It is teacher-switch-on-able but it would be conceivable to add a little switch for students to switch it on or off within their portfolio or on the published site. In addition, this year we are making a content repository which will integrate into this rich well of student projects. I am also curious to see how learners could automatically click a "publish to wiki" button when a project is done.
Re: Moodle as New Facebook
The Project Module sounds nice!
One thing that impresses me with Moodle is that all ideas are given consideration. With most FLOSS development projects, I'm usually told to keep my weird ideas to myself and send Bugzilla reports if the software behaves in an unexpected way. In this here Moodle Lounge, I go on the slippery slope of thought experiment and I'm told some of these things were already planned.
Neat!
I do agree with Don. Pretty soon, Moodle will be a range of different things. And we may not even know yet what they will be. The beauty of Open Source done right.
As for Facebook and Explode. I've been given them a bit more thought (as well as starting to fill my networks). A fair bit has to do with the private/public continuum. What content do we want to share with whom and at what time. From a draft version of a mashup to potential quiz questions, from diary-like blog entries to pointed questions. All of this is quite important, to me. These issues might even recontextualise the "intellectual property lobbying system." Once a Project is published, keeping all the ties to the original work, users of the content can be co-creators of new work. To my mind, thoughtful collaboration can have more impact than mere "credit" or even "loyalties" (disclaimer: I'm a musician).
One thing that impresses me with Moodle is that all ideas are given consideration. With most FLOSS development projects, I'm usually told to keep my weird ideas to myself and send Bugzilla reports if the software behaves in an unexpected way. In this here Moodle Lounge, I go on the slippery slope of thought experiment and I'm told some of these things were already planned.
Neat!
I do agree with Don. Pretty soon, Moodle will be a range of different things. And we may not even know yet what they will be. The beauty of Open Source done right.
As for Facebook and Explode. I've been given them a bit more thought (as well as starting to fill my networks). A fair bit has to do with the private/public continuum. What content do we want to share with whom and at what time. From a draft version of a mashup to potential quiz questions, from diary-like blog entries to pointed questions. All of this is quite important, to me. These issues might even recontextualise the "intellectual property lobbying system." Once a Project is published, keeping all the ties to the original work, users of the content can be co-creators of new work. To my mind, thoughtful collaboration can have more impact than mere "credit" or even "loyalties" (disclaimer: I'm a musician).
Re: Moodle as New Facebook
"I like the idea of a student being able to transform a graded course assignment into publicly available content by "the flip of a switch."
Yes, this would be extremely cool. It'd be great if both the teacher (as in your example) or the student (as in Alex's example) could do it.
Or maybe you could set it up so that (optionally) both had to approve? Hmm...
Yes, this would be extremely cool. It'd be great if both the teacher (as in your example) or the student (as in Alex's example) could do it.
Or maybe you could set it up so that (optionally) both had to approve? Hmm...
Re: Moodle as New Facebook
Yes, this would be extremely cool. It'd be great if both the teacher (as in your example) or the student (as in Alex's example) could do it.
This is pretty much standard ePortfolio requirement. I think Matt's SPDC portfolio does this? A corrollary to the below, how do you keep people doing great work when the project goes a different direction (ePortfolio, blogs)?
This is pretty much standard ePortfolio requirement. I think Matt's SPDC portfolio does this? A corrollary to the below, how do you keep people doing great work when the project goes a different direction (ePortfolio, blogs)?
Re: Moodle as New Facebook
So, the requirement is that both the student and the instructor approve the project, here? Two switches?
Would it work if a student were to have a button for "I authorise this work to be published?" Maybe this could be associated with consent forms?
Actually, I see the same idea apply to course material. Once course material has been put in the public, you can improve on it. It does change the work of the instructor, but it goes well with the "spirit of inquiry" which animates all of us. As it turns out, I'm trying to send a proposal for a session on open course materials to that Spirit of Inquiry conference. Thoughts?
Would it work if a student were to have a button for "I authorise this work to be published?" Maybe this could be associated with consent forms?
how do you keep people doing great work when the project goes a different direction (ePortfolio, blogs)?
Maybe I don't fully understand this question but, to me, someone who does great work and publishes it in another format can then move on to other things, standing on the shoulders of their own giants.Actually, I see the same idea apply to course material. Once course material has been put in the public, you can improve on it. It does change the work of the instructor, but it goes well with the "spirit of inquiry" which animates all of us. As it turns out, I'm trying to send a proposal for a session on open course materials to that Spirit of Inquiry conference. Thoughts?
Re: Moodle as New Facebook
So, the requirement is that both the student and the instructor approve the project, here? Two switches?
Would it work if a student were to have a button for "I authorise this work to be published?" Maybe this could be associated with consent forms?
Yeah... I'm wondering about the ethical issues that might arise from a teacher unilaterally deciding to publish something that the student had written under the expectation of privacy.
We have our students sign a consent form when they come in to the program because we're doing research on them -- but we still ask them before publishing anything has their name attached (as opposed to anonymized data in a research paper).
I'm thinking of some wonderful videos that some of our students created in a multimedia class. Some of those were deeply personal -- although they were willing to share them with the small group of classmates they'd been working with for the last two years, I wouldn't assume that they were okay with sharing that stuff with the entire world.
Would it work if a student were to have a button for "I authorise this work to be published?" Maybe this could be associated with consent forms?
Yeah... I'm wondering about the ethical issues that might arise from a teacher unilaterally deciding to publish something that the student had written under the expectation of privacy.
We have our students sign a consent form when they come in to the program because we're doing research on them -- but we still ask them before publishing anything has their name attached (as opposed to anonymized data in a research paper).
I'm thinking of some wonderful videos that some of our students created in a multimedia class. Some of those were deeply personal -- although they were willing to share them with the small group of classmates they'd been working with for the last two years, I wouldn't assume that they were okay with sharing that stuff with the entire world.
Re: Moodle as New Facebook
I think I (and possibly Don and Alexandre) would like a system that lets you publish any work, regardless of whether it was put into an individual's eportfolio.
For instance, I might see a great forum post from one of my students. I then "nominate" it for publication. If the student approves, it automatically goes into a collection (organized how?) called "The Best of EPSY 556: Analysis of Advanced Instructional Technologies" (or whatever).
Besides providing recognition to the authors, this would be a great resource for potential students who were wondering what the class was about.
It looks like the SPDC portfolio does part of this, but I'm not clear whether it lets you make a course-oriented collection as well as one associated with an individual student?
For instance, I might see a great forum post from one of my students. I then "nominate" it for publication. If the student approves, it automatically goes into a collection (organized how?) called "The Best of EPSY 556: Analysis of Advanced Instructional Technologies" (or whatever).
Besides providing recognition to the authors, this would be a great resource for potential students who were wondering what the class was about.
It looks like the SPDC portfolio does part of this, but I'm not clear whether it lets you make a course-oriented collection as well as one associated with an individual student?
Re: Moodle as New Facebook
"publicly available content by "the flip of a switch.""
You can do this with blog posts in elgg. Each blog post can be assigned and re-assigned privacy levels but I don't know how this works in an institutional elgg implementation.
I was in a curriculum development approval meeting this morning, defending a new module using 'Emerging Technologies '. The INformation Services Division rep mentioned issues to with 'negotiating the firewall' with Web 2.0 type software. This is not just a technical issue for institutions but also an ethical/administrative, Intellectual Property, etc.,etc. one.
Also regarding project management tools, has anyone used Fronter? http://fronter.info/com/
I saw it demoed at a conference and it looked very interesting.
You can do this with blog posts in elgg. Each blog post can be assigned and re-assigned privacy levels but I don't know how this works in an institutional elgg implementation.
I was in a curriculum development approval meeting this morning, defending a new module using 'Emerging Technologies '. The INformation Services Division rep mentioned issues to with 'negotiating the firewall' with Web 2.0 type software. This is not just a technical issue for institutions but also an ethical/administrative, Intellectual Property, etc.,etc. one.
Also regarding project management tools, has anyone used Fronter? http://fronter.info/com/
I saw it demoed at a conference and it looked very interesting.
Fronter
Hi Frances et al
I used Fronter to run an organic gardening course for WEA (Workers' Educational Assocation) in 2005. Although it was a bit fiddly to set up, it worked well enough for learners/tutor and looked quite nice (slightly neater look than Moodle as less boxy). We moved to Moodle for subsequent courses as Fronter charged both a basic fee and per student fee. I'm pretty wedded to Moodle now so I don't know what I'd choose if both were free. Anyway if you're interested, the report I wrote for WEA is on their website and it contains info and screenshots of the Fronter VLE in action.
I used Fronter to run an organic gardening course for WEA (Workers' Educational Assocation) in 2005. Although it was a bit fiddly to set up, it worked well enough for learners/tutor and looked quite nice (slightly neater look than Moodle as less boxy). We moved to Moodle for subsequent courses as Fronter charged both a basic fee and per student fee. I'm pretty wedded to Moodle now so I don't know what I'd choose if both were free. Anyway if you're interested, the report I wrote for WEA is on their website and it contains info and screenshots of the Fronter VLE in action.
Re: Fronter
Danielle,
Nice report! Quite detailed, easy to browse, nice use of graphics...
From that report's screenshots, I would agree that the overall look is a bit better than the standard Moodle look. Of course, some Moodlers have been designing better-looking sites. The other thing I personally like is that it seems to have more of an outline format, which can be quite efficient in many cases.
Of course, both of these features relate to FlexPage {well, some module that has a similar name....}, which I didn't know about until recently. In fact, it even seems that flexpages are even more like Digg's redesign than Fronter is.
So, yet again, Moodle is incorporating neat features from other CMS/VLE/LMS.
(When did I become such a Moodle apologist, again? Must be the weather... )
Nice report! Quite detailed, easy to browse, nice use of graphics...
From that report's screenshots, I would agree that the overall look is a bit better than the standard Moodle look. Of course, some Moodlers have been designing better-looking sites. The other thing I personally like is that it seems to have more of an outline format, which can be quite efficient in many cases.
Of course, both of these features relate to FlexPage {well, some module that has a similar name....}, which I didn't know about until recently. In fact, it even seems that flexpages are even more like Digg's redesign than Fronter is.
So, yet again, Moodle is incorporating neat features from other CMS/VLE/LMS.
(When did I become such a Moodle apologist, again? Must be the weather...
FlexiblePage (was: Fronter)
BTW, what I was referring to was Michael Penney's impressive FlexiblePage, not called "FlexPage" like I first thought (and didn't find in the 30 minutes of editing delay).
As it turns out, it was used in discussions of Moodle's UI. Never realised that the UI problems were so well-known. Personally, it matters more in terms of efficiency than in terms of cuteness-factor. So all the AJAX-like projects seem quite important, to me.
As it turns out, it was used in discussions of Moodle's UI. Never realised that the UI problems were so well-known. Personally, it matters more in terms of efficiency than in terms of cuteness-factor. So all the AJAX-like projects seem quite important, to me.
Fronter License (was: Moodle as New Facebook)
Am I too cynical or isn't funny that a system which claims to be an "open learning platform" should have such a convoluted licensing system?
The Fronter VLE is a licensed, subscription-based application service. Pricing is tiered, based on the number of people ("users"). In general, the price-per-user decreases as the number of users increases.
Don't get me wrong, there's nothing inherently un-open about subscriptions and licenses. But I tend to associate openness of a system with a different approach to fees (as in, sliding scales for non-profit organisations, low-cost trials, etc.).Re: Fronter License (was: Moodle as New Facebook)
It's clear that there there is Open Source and there is open source. The 'licensing' of Fronter merits discussion.
But it's nice - isn't it?
But it's nice - isn't it?
Re: Fronter License (was: Moodle as New Facebook)
It does look nice and Danielle's report is quite helpful to understand what it can do.
I might still prefer Moodle as LMS/VLE/CMS, unless there's something big I missed like the ability to make barista-level espresso at the flip of a switch...
I might still prefer Moodle as LMS/VLE/CMS, unless there's something big I missed like the ability to make barista-level espresso at the flip of a switch...
Re: Fronter License (was: Moodle as New Facebook)
Postscript:
I just found this interesting discussion on Fronter.
I just found this interesting discussion on Fronter.
Re: Fronter License (was: Moodle as New Facebook)
I must be reading the comments wrong...is that Miles Berry saying:
I really like Fronter. It si by far the best VLE I have tried. We have spent one year looking into different systems and Fronter is by far the best. It really works......, and it is easy to use! The support we have received from Fronter in England is also superb...
Re: Fronter License (was: Moodle as New Facebook)
No that wasn't Miles' comment.
Elgg sometimes does something dodgy with the comments so that icon from previous comment is put alongside a comment - very confusing!
Elgg sometimes does something dodgy with the comments so that icon from previous comment is put alongside a comment - very confusing!
Re: Moodle as New Facebook
I'm not sure how (okay, I have a small idea--see my profile pic), but I accidentally let my enrollment lapse here in the social forum and missed this great topic. It's timely for me as I was just reflecting this week that I need to find some way to make my courses more user-generated with more user-investment. I've had an advisor/advisee course for my now junior girls for three years, but they are MUCH more active in their own Facebook accounts. Just this week one of them did an impromptu poll in our group and found that almost all of them have Facebook accounts. She said, "we should have an advisor/advisee group!" They then explained to me how easy it is to set up groups in Facebook. I've avoided looking into it myself as colleagues who have looked found too much info there--posts by kids that aren't always so favorable to their teachers. Anyway, I reflected that I wished I could better capitalize on that same "owned by me" enthusiasm for our Moodle site that they have for Facebook.
Early on in the school year, I temporarily gave one of my students access as a non-editing teacher (we're still on 1.6 on my site), but didn't like the power and access she'd have to profiles and other private info of the other students. Am looking forward to working with roles when we roll out in the next stable version next year.
As for Facebook, I bit my tongue and decided not to get involved in their decision to make a group or not (thought it would be too much like "mom" poking her nose in where she wasn't wanted; they are 16 after all). Am okay with them developing their own social networks on their own. I think I might have them link from their Facebook profiles to their Moodle profiles, though, and do some other modifications. They want to be able to post pics on their own, that kind of thing, and Facebook allows for that. I will definitely be reading your blog with the comments from Michael Penney about Facebook and Moodle. Have to run again for now, though. Thanks for raising this topic!
Best,
Lesli
Early on in the school year, I temporarily gave one of my students access as a non-editing teacher (we're still on 1.6 on my site), but didn't like the power and access she'd have to profiles and other private info of the other students. Am looking forward to working with roles when we roll out in the next stable version next year.
As for Facebook, I bit my tongue and decided not to get involved in their decision to make a group or not (thought it would be too much like "mom" poking her nose in where she wasn't wanted; they are 16 after all). Am okay with them developing their own social networks on their own. I think I might have them link from their Facebook profiles to their Moodle profiles, though, and do some other modifications. They want to be able to post pics on their own, that kind of thing, and Facebook allows for that. I will definitely be reading your blog with the comments from Michael Penney about Facebook and Moodle. Have to run again for now, though. Thanks for raising this topic!
Best,
Lesli
Re: Moodle as New Facebook
Hello Lesli!
Thanks a lot for this reply! We seem to be on to something. I don't focus on the technical aspects but I think the social and personal dimensions of social networking in learning contexts are quite important.
Here's my personal experience narrative (aka anecdote).
I'm still a relative n00b in the Moodle community and my only role is as an instructor at a university which uses Moodle (not even sure which version). I tend to get overly enthusiastic about what Moodle can become and do but your reply comforts me in the idea that my wishful thinking isn't that far off.
As a social scientist looking at social networks, I've been quite impressed by Facebook recently. I created an account during the Fall 2005 semester after listening to a podcast about the lack of privacy students seem comfortable with, in terms of their Facebook profiles. I didn't do much with that account until recently. I had heard, on the Buzz Out Loud podcast, about recent changes in Facebook and got the impression that Fb was the new MySpace. I also got a Friend Request from former students, once in a while, and noticed a couple of things, but didn't pay much attention.
Then, recently, after teaching about social networks in an intro to culture class, I decided to shape up my Fb network. After making sure that Fb would let me choose recipients, I allowed Fb to import my Gmail contacts (pretty much the same way LinkedIn does it) and selected several of my friends to be in my Fb network. Within 24 hours, I had more friends in my Fb network than I ever had on any other social networking site (including LinkedIn, MySpace, Linkup, and the now-defunct SixDegrees). To me, this shows the power of Fb and it brought back the point about the convergence of different user-centric online systems (learning management systems, social networking sites, blogs, user-generated content diffusion, mashup, podcasting, social bookmarking, email lists, Web forums, IM, etc.). In my mind, the "winner of the Web 2.0 bubble" will be the people who can combine all of the technologies and uses of these converging systems.
Now, to go back to Moodle as a Facebook-like social networking platform. Lesli's point about privacy of Moodle profiles is well-taken yet there is something to be said about users managing their own privacy themselves. On Fb, younger members tend to give away too much information. On a local brewclub mailing-list, we discussed this very thing in relation with Fb. Some people (including two relatively young engineers) feel that Fb is dangerous because of the TMI principle. The argument is "these kids don't understand that their future employers will look at their Fb profiles and might not hire them because of things in these profiles." The reverse argument (made by social scientists like myself) is that students are still negotiating their social identity and know how to use the power of networks to get more opportunities for collaboration, including paid work. The very success of Fb, to me, provides some support for the idea that the full-transparency strategy is often the best one. Not that privacy isn't important. But privacy itself is, well, relative.
One of the advantages of Moodle is that roles can be managed in context. Contrary to Bb, it's not simply "Teacher" and "Student," as one can redefine the terms and their impact. IMHO, Sakai is even stronger than Moodle in this respect (especially in terms of document access and copyright) but this is an obvious way Moodle is so compatible with constructivism.
What I personally envision is a Moodle system in which learners (including faculty members) are able to connect with others based on their own preferences and interests. Social networks are typically amorphous, acephalous (headless), egalitarian, non-hierarchical, user-based, and fluid. These characteristics are part of what makes the Internet itself so powerful.
At the same time, classes/courses/teams/groups are clearly structured and often hierarchical. This is usually what's missing on social networking sites and it's absolutely essential for formal learning in schools (at this point in time). Because Moodle already has the "course and group" structure, it just needs the "fluid network" part to be a serious competitor to both Bb and Fb.
I personally hope that Moodle will win this one.
Thanks a lot for this reply! We seem to be on to something. I don't focus on the technical aspects but I think the social and personal dimensions of social networking in learning contexts are quite important.
Here's my personal experience narrative (aka anecdote).
I'm still a relative n00b in the Moodle community and my only role is as an instructor at a university which uses Moodle (not even sure which version). I tend to get overly enthusiastic about what Moodle can become and do but your reply comforts me in the idea that my wishful thinking isn't that far off.
As a social scientist looking at social networks, I've been quite impressed by Facebook recently. I created an account during the Fall 2005 semester after listening to a podcast about the lack of privacy students seem comfortable with, in terms of their Facebook profiles. I didn't do much with that account until recently. I had heard, on the Buzz Out Loud podcast, about recent changes in Facebook and got the impression that Fb was the new MySpace. I also got a Friend Request from former students, once in a while, and noticed a couple of things, but didn't pay much attention.
Then, recently, after teaching about social networks in an intro to culture class, I decided to shape up my Fb network. After making sure that Fb would let me choose recipients, I allowed Fb to import my Gmail contacts (pretty much the same way LinkedIn does it) and selected several of my friends to be in my Fb network. Within 24 hours, I had more friends in my Fb network than I ever had on any other social networking site (including LinkedIn, MySpace, Linkup, and the now-defunct SixDegrees). To me, this shows the power of Fb and it brought back the point about the convergence of different user-centric online systems (learning management systems, social networking sites, blogs, user-generated content diffusion, mashup, podcasting, social bookmarking, email lists, Web forums, IM, etc.). In my mind, the "winner of the Web 2.0 bubble" will be the people who can combine all of the technologies and uses of these converging systems.
Now, to go back to Moodle as a Facebook-like social networking platform. Lesli's point about privacy of Moodle profiles is well-taken yet there is something to be said about users managing their own privacy themselves. On Fb, younger members tend to give away too much information. On a local brewclub mailing-list, we discussed this very thing in relation with Fb. Some people (including two relatively young engineers) feel that Fb is dangerous because of the TMI principle. The argument is "these kids don't understand that their future employers will look at their Fb profiles and might not hire them because of things in these profiles." The reverse argument (made by social scientists like myself) is that students are still negotiating their social identity and know how to use the power of networks to get more opportunities for collaboration, including paid work. The very success of Fb, to me, provides some support for the idea that the full-transparency strategy is often the best one. Not that privacy isn't important. But privacy itself is, well, relative.
One of the advantages of Moodle is that roles can be managed in context. Contrary to Bb, it's not simply "Teacher" and "Student," as one can redefine the terms and their impact. IMHO, Sakai is even stronger than Moodle in this respect (especially in terms of document access and copyright) but this is an obvious way Moodle is so compatible with constructivism.
What I personally envision is a Moodle system in which learners (including faculty members) are able to connect with others based on their own preferences and interests. Social networks are typically amorphous, acephalous (headless), egalitarian, non-hierarchical, user-based, and fluid. These characteristics are part of what makes the Internet itself so powerful.
At the same time, classes/courses/teams/groups are clearly structured and often hierarchical. This is usually what's missing on social networking sites and it's absolutely essential for formal learning in schools (at this point in time). Because Moodle already has the "course and group" structure, it just needs the "fluid network" part to be a serious competitor to both Bb and Fb.
I personally hope that Moodle will win this one.
Family Moodle
Hey - just ran across the post and the comment from Michael Penney.
I actually just put together a “family moodle” with the exact same setup at Penney described! Each family member has her/his own “course” that they can control. It works quite well with the automatic RSS feeds and simple commenting setup within the e-mails that get sent out and the forums.
The “course enrollment password” also allows screening so that outsiders can only access certain pages. For example, I gave my friends my course password so they can get in - but they are “locked out” from my brother’s course and news.
Naturally, there is the main news section on the front page, along with other items for everyone to share. I’ve found using the “dictionary” is a more user friendly database that be used to store files and content. (Inspired by John Clayton of the Waikato Institute of Tech and Jun Iwata of the Matsue National College of Technology at the Illinois Online Conference 2007)
I even use one “dictionary” as our master family recipe book - which allows for easy searching and printing! (and pictures too if we want)
So what’s next? Networking would open up simple cross connections that moodle 1.7 lacks. I just started toying with the networking feature in 1.8, but have yet to get it working properly. Here’s a few other “facebook like features I’d like to see:”
1. Universal recent news feed or Enhanced blogs
–>I’ve seen a mod for recent blog entries - but the blog function in moodle still is quite basic and doesn’t have the same capabilities as forum mod
2. User friendly picture gallery & upload
–>I’m using the jpeg gallery right now - which works… but it’s not user friendly at all - especially for non-moodlers or non-computer people. A solid mod that would allow for the uploading of MULTIPLE photos simultaneously and automatically resize them, create thumbnails, and maybe even do a slide show would be hot.
3. User friendly theme modification
–> As we all know, the big thing with MySpace, Facebook, etc is the ability to make the page “your” page. There still are a limited number of themes out there, and it’s not easy for simple people to create or edit their own theme. I think this is an essential enhancement if the general public is ever going to get into moodle as a facebook like system
4. Simple navigation between “courses”
–> Perhaps the main issue at the moment is that when a user looks at his/her list of courses he/she is enrolled it - it can be a massive list of 20,30,40+ family members! Some type of simple visual method of navigating through the forest of “friend courses” you’re enrolled/connected to is needed.
–> There also needs to be some type of differentiation between a “person’s course” and a “group” course. For example - I might setup a separate course to serve as a group homepage for everyone coming to my wedding. It’s separate from my personal course (because not everyone is invited) but it still just shows up in the general list of “courses” in the site. Although now that I think about, I could use course categories to create this differentiation. I’ll have to test that out-
Thus - Penney is right on with the fact that people buy into the terminology of moodle and fail to see its flexibility. I honestly sat down and mapped out ways I could pull off my “family moodle” and what setup would give me the best options … forums for everyone, courses, for everyone, etc. Even the use of the dictionary as a user friendly database that allows commenting never crossed my mind until I heard John and Jun. But at the end of the day, I need to keep reminding myself that Moodle is FREE and I’m lucky enough to even be able to use it as a tool. It truly has changed education.
Re: Family Moodle
Chris,
Thanks for your comment on my blog. You seem as enthusiastic as I am, which can be dangerous.
In fact, to take a step back from this enthusiasm (it's easier to do with someone else's enthusiasm)... There's a good degree of "bricolage" in open-source projects in the sense that not only are our tools a bit like Maslow's metaphorical hammer but our nails give us ideas about very complex, multi-purpose tools. In a way, we reinvent the wheel from the existence of the chariot. Or something like that.
Haven't read the messages in the teaching effectiveness thread yet but there might be a feeling that we're getting away from Moodle's "core purpose," here. Not that I think such a move is illogical. But we should be careful about where this may lead us.
Of course, I really like your ideas.
The last two points (profile and group/"course" navigation) seem the most fundamental, here. The first two (blog and gallery) can possibly be mashed up using existing systems. Elaborate profiles and flexible groups are the main strengths of current SNS, IMHO.
The whole OpenID/Elgg/Explode ideas really have to do with a stable persona across contexts. A cross-site, partly-public, fully-customisable Moodle profile could do a lot to make Moodle more "marketable" as the profile can be brought from one institution (say, a high school) to another (say, a university). Students don't make the purchasing decisions but it's funny how widespread adoption of Moodle for other uses could drive a kind of grassroots movement to have Moodle as at least one of the possible LMS.
Courses and groups are, in a way, the same thing. Apart from technical issues related to hosting, there's no reason to restrict a course and/or group to a single institution. "Merging" Moodle sites from different schools can be a technical challenge but seamlessly integrating Moodle courses and groups from different context has more to do with UI and authentication than with hosting. Apart from collaborative projects between different universities, it could foster a climate of informal collaboration between education and other domains, including business and public service.
Yes, yes... I'm doing exactly what I described as potentially dangerous. Think of it as a thought experiment.
Thanks for your comment on my blog. You seem as enthusiastic as I am, which can be dangerous.
In fact, to take a step back from this enthusiasm (it's easier to do with someone else's enthusiasm)... There's a good degree of "bricolage" in open-source projects in the sense that not only are our tools a bit like Maslow's metaphorical hammer but our nails give us ideas about very complex, multi-purpose tools. In a way, we reinvent the wheel from the existence of the chariot. Or something like that.
Haven't read the messages in the teaching effectiveness thread yet but there might be a feeling that we're getting away from Moodle's "core purpose," here. Not that I think such a move is illogical. But we should be careful about where this may lead us.
Of course, I really like your ideas.
The last two points (profile and group/"course" navigation) seem the most fundamental, here. The first two (blog and gallery) can possibly be mashed up using existing systems. Elaborate profiles and flexible groups are the main strengths of current SNS, IMHO.
The whole OpenID/Elgg/Explode ideas really have to do with a stable persona across contexts. A cross-site, partly-public, fully-customisable Moodle profile could do a lot to make Moodle more "marketable" as the profile can be brought from one institution (say, a high school) to another (say, a university). Students don't make the purchasing decisions but it's funny how widespread adoption of Moodle for other uses could drive a kind of grassroots movement to have Moodle as at least one of the possible LMS.
Courses and groups are, in a way, the same thing. Apart from technical issues related to hosting, there's no reason to restrict a course and/or group to a single institution. "Merging" Moodle sites from different schools can be a technical challenge but seamlessly integrating Moodle courses and groups from different context has more to do with UI and authentication than with hosting. Apart from collaborative projects between different universities, it could foster a climate of informal collaboration between education and other domains, including business and public service.
Yes, yes... I'm doing exactly what I described as potentially dangerous. Think of it as a thought experiment.
Re: Family Moodle
Alexandre
As far as social networking on moodle is concerned, I find that Summer of Code 2007 has this particular project, enhancing moodle with requiste features. Otherwise, I would prefer Single Sign On features with existing open source Social Networking software such as Elgg or PeopleAggregator. Either ways, it seems to be coming around to the educational community, that students need to be given some freedom online to interact outside the boundaries of courses and social networking is required as an essential feature of an LMS
As far as social networking on moodle is concerned, I find that Summer of Code 2007 has this particular project, enhancing moodle with requiste features. Otherwise, I would prefer Single Sign On features with existing open source Social Networking software such as Elgg or PeopleAggregator. Either ways, it seems to be coming around to the educational community, that students need to be given some freedom online to interact outside the boundaries of courses and social networking is required as an essential feature of an LMS
Re: Family Moodle
Pretty neat projects!
Nothing more motivating than students reflecting on tools and uses. I do like this specific one Anil is pointing to as well as the WIKINDX bibliography one. Seems like students are thinking about similar issues as we are. (And I had not encountered WIKINDX before. Pretty much what I have been looking for, for a while.)
Thanks, Anil!
Re: Family Moodle
Good on you, Chris, glad you are finding good uses for Moodle 
.
Ultimately most of Moodle is a hierarchy of containers so there's a lot of uses to which it can be put if you're creative.
Ultimately most of Moodle is a hierarchy of containers so there's a lot of uses to which it can be put if you're creative.