Hi everyone!
It seems that Debian's moodle packages will be removed for the jessie release: https://bugs.debian.org/754565
If you use the Debian or Ubuntu moodle package and don't want this to happen, you'll need to speak now and help maintain it.
Given the popularity of Ubuntu (although I note that Mint is now the distro that is climbing - largely because of the Ubuntu Unity Desktop issue) it's a little sad to see Moodle being dropped.
That said, the official recommended way to install Moodle in now via git (which I think is a horrible decision - expecting average part-time IT people, teachers, and part-time Admins to learn git solely to install Moodle - I can't think of another popular application like Moodle that requires git to install?) At least now we have the beautiful and simple GUI plugin updater
However, I thought the version of Moodle available in Ubuntu was always quite out-of-date - mainly because of Moodle's very rapid development cycle, so I would never really recommend installing from Ubuntu anyway!
Unless Ubuntu gets a one-click install of Blackboard or Canvas it might be better in fact for people to go via Moodle downloads to get the installation file ?
I would never (and I know many others with the same opinion too) suggest users of Ubuntu or Debian to install Moodle using the aptitude package. As you say Stuart the package is always quite out of date and potentially exposes users to security issues longer then necessary.
It is so easy to use Debian or Ubuntu to install all the prerequisite packages (LAMP stack etc.) for Moodle and install Moodle from the manual downloads (or git if you are that way inclined! ), that I see little need for the aptitude package. The removal of it may in fact simplify things for Debain and Ubuntu users...
Just my thoughts...
Jon
+1
'Debian based Linux: Ban "apt-get install moodle"!' https://moodle.org/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=196512.
OK, it was almost three years ago. I wonder whether the main issue has been solved in between.
'Debian based Linux: Ban "apt-get install moodle"!' https://moodle.org/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=196512.
OK, it was almost three years ago. I wonder whether the main issue has been solved in between.
Hi,
As I mentioned on the debian bug - I do think this is the right course of action. And I agree in general that the Debian packaging model does not perfectly fit with Moodle (or a lot of php webapps). There is less benefit from the packaging than say, a compiled c program.
But I think we should be clear - if we could get significantly motivated contributors - the package could be well maintained and secure. Debian have a very robust process for tracking security issues and distributing security updates and these days they release frequently enough with two year time based freezes (I'm sure a lot of institutions wish we had that cadence in Moodle ).
Despite lack of users using the package, I think we have gained a lot from being in Debian over the years. One example of that is that often users vet the packages for their free software credentials and file bugs about files which might be questionably licensed - that has on multiple occasions led to bugs filed in Moodle and fixed. They have also raised bugs with us about security issues in bundled libraries. Both are things we should be catching ourselves, of course - but its great to have more eyes.
In reply to Dan Poltawski
Re: Debian moodle package to be removed in jessie
by Visvanath Ratnaweera -
Dan
Quite possibly Moodle has got more users (administrators) thanks to the Debian package. The question is, how many of them are (were) happy. Nothing against the Moodle package, this kind if "hidden" installations might save an hour or two maximum of the future system administrator, but can make his life miserable later, for the simple reason, that he has to maintain the site for years to come!
Quite possibly Moodle has got more users (administrators) thanks to the Debian package. The question is, how many of them are (were) happy. Nothing against the Moodle package, this kind if "hidden" installations might save an hour or two maximum of the future system administrator, but can make his life miserable later, for the simple reason, that he has to maintain the site for years to come!
In reply to Visvanath Ratnaweera
Re: Debian moodle package to be removed in jessie
by Dan Poltawski -
Quite possibly Moodle has got more users (administrators) thanks to the Debian package. The question is, how many of them are (were) happy.
If you see above - that was not an argument I was making for the package.
Though people can become 'miserable' starting with Moodle in a variety of ways where they don't control the whole stack - I realise we often get confused debian users joining our community but I don't think its a compelling reason against it. In fact it might be a way to get more users even just the fact we are 'in' common linux distros.
Just noting that Joost van Baal-Ilić has taken over the package for Debian unstable and will keep it in Debian yay
Glad to see someone's volunteered to give it some TLC. Many moons ago I looked into helping with Debian, and later Fedora's Moodle packages, but ended up discourage.
There is a serious mismatch between Moodle's release and support cycle and distros with long maintenance cycles (such as Debian, Ubuntu LTS, RHEL/CentOS). Their support/maint cycle is long, and they won't accept a major release update within the lifetime of one of their releases.
Software packages with relatively short maint cycles, such as Moodle, cannot promise to provide security support for such a long time.
There is a better way, IMO: publish faster-moving packages. Debian has the "volatile" repo. Ubuntu has PPAs. Fedora/CentOS/RHEL has COPR...
There is a serious mismatch between Moodle's release and support cycle and distros with long maintenance cycles (such as Debian, Ubuntu LTS, RHEL/CentOS). Their support/maint cycle is long, and they won't accept a major release update within the lifetime of one of their releases.
Software packages with relatively short maint cycles, such as Moodle, cannot promise to provide security support for such a long time.
There is a better way, IMO: publish faster-moving packages. Debian has the "volatile" repo. Ubuntu has PPAs. Fedora/CentOS/RHEL has COPR...
Another way would be to publish a set of scripts to download moodle from authoritative sources and keep it up-to-date. Not sure that's any better, and would require much effort!
Getting into Debian volatile would probably be the better solution.
Andrew