Grades in Graderview total correctly, but in User, things get wrong.

Grades in Graderview total correctly, but in User, things get wrong.

by Nic Ruley -
Number of replies: 14

Hey all. Using Moodle 2.5.1

We had an issue yesterday when (for reasons we couldn't understand) when two instructors added marks for their grade book, it marked the course total as "overwritten" and gave it an odd value.

I ran the mySQL query to clear the flags, and reset the categories by changing them FROM sum and changing them back TO sum. All is right with the world. All graders look alike.

But those who had issues with the locked grade, when they go to a user report, we see the funny math again. 

Here is the grader:

Course totals working out like champs!!

But then I go into the user view. And here is the bottom where the course tallies are at.

 

 

My aggregate is a simple sum of grades, and as you can see below, that ain't a simple sum of grades.

 

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

In reply to Nic Ruley

Re: Grades in Graderview total correctly, but in User, things get wrong.

by Emma Richardson -
Picture of Documentation writers Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Plugin developers

In Admin settings/grades/reports/user report, see if unchecking Show Percentages fixes it.  If it is only in a couple of courses, check the settings within the gradebook there for the same setting.

In reply to Nic Ruley

Re: Grades in Graderview total correctly, but in User, things get wrong.

by Emma Richardson -
Picture of Documentation writers Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Plugin developers

In Admin settings/grades/reports/user report, see if unchecking Show Percentages fixes it.  If it is only in a couple of courses, check the settings within the gradebook there for the same setting.

In reply to Emma Richardson

Re: Grades in Graderview total correctly, but in User, things get wrong.

by Nic Ruley -

Tried both, but no luck.

For the categories with the problematic arithmetic, I also checked and unchecked "include subcategories" and "aggregate only non-empty grades". Also didn't work.

Found this morning that this issue was for all courses under this section. The subcategories add up correctly, but adding those into a larger category seems to add a multiplier that is less than one.

For example:

First category (Interactive Work( = 0
Second category (Written Work) = 1.5
(First total = 0.58) Third Category (Class Participation) = 0
Course Total = .33

I'm convinced there is an errant setting somewhere, but again, this only happens in the user report - which is the report that the students see.

              

In reply to Nic Ruley

Re: Grades in Graderview total correctly, but in User, things get wrong.

by Nic Ruley -

My settings are below - primarily default. 

Is there a way to force a recalculation? Or somewhere I can see the math being used to come up with the total?

Attachment Screen Shot 2013-09-19 at 8.15.21 AM.png
In reply to Nic Ruley

Re: Grades in Graderview total correctly, but in User, things get wrong.

by Bob Puffer -

I think it likely this is fixed now that you're using the LAE Grader report though you probably would want my hacks to the User report (formally known as the LAE User report) so the students see the correct total.

I've had mixed luck with going back and forth between Sum of grades and SWM.  I know its done primarily to get the correct max points but I've seen numerous instances where it screwed up the stored math. 

If you want to force a recalculation of a courses gradebook the SQL looks like this:

UPDATE mdl_grade_items i SET needsupdate = 1 WHERE i.courseid = <COURSE ID FOR THE COURSE YOU WANT UPDATED>

Refreshing the grade screen will then recalc all.

In order to really analyze what's taking place here we'd want to see the Categories and items screen.

In reply to Bob Puffer

Re: Grades in Graderview total correctly, but in User, things get wrong.

by Nic Ruley -

Ran query on mySql and the User Report is unchanged. I just keep feeling that there has to be a setting I'm missing somewhere. Below are the screen captures of the Categories and Items, in descending order.

The one really funny thing is the hidden group marked "ignore these items". Those are assignments with no grade attached to them. The grade items above (worth 1.5 each) are the points allotted for the assignments with no grade.

Attachment Screen-Shot-2013-09-19-at-1.35.41-PM.jpg
Attachment Screen-Shot-2013-09-19-at-1.35.50-PM.jpg
In reply to Nic Ruley

Re: Grades in Graderview total correctly, but in User, things get wrong.

by Nic Ruley -

Next section.

Attachment Screen-Shot-2013-09-19-at-1.35.58-PM.jpg
Attachment Screen-Shot-2013-09-19-at-1.36.08-PM.jpg
In reply to Nic Ruley

Re: Grades in Graderview total correctly, but in User, things get wrong.

by Nic Ruley -

Final. Sorry for the multiple postings.

Attachment Screen Shot 2013-09-19 at 1.36.25 PM.png
Attachment Screen-Shot-2013-09-19-at-1.36.17-PM.jpg
In reply to Nic Ruley

Re: Grades in Graderview total correctly, but in User, things get wrong.

by Nic Ruley -

Okay, I'm able to re-create the anomaly (in part - it's fairly inconsistent) and work backwards to see that the issue seems to be the hidden items. Once those items are unhidden, everything works like a charm. 

And LAE Grader also fixes the issue.

In reply to Nic Ruley

Re: Grades in Graderview total correctly, but in User, things get wrong.

by Bob Puffer -

I don't see the aggregation on your Cats and items screen -- is it Sum of grades?  Sorry if you've mentioned this before.  Forum stopped sending out digests Friday.  I don't think Sum of grades correctly handles hidden items (or not at least what we'd call 'correct').  I've finally gotten the nerve to kick the remaining fifteen instructors off Sum of grades and I'm eliminating it from the list of aggregation methods leaving only WM and SWM which handle everything as long as you're using accuratepoints hacks.

In reply to Bob Puffer

Re: Grades in Graderview total correctly, but in User, things get wrong.

by Nic Ruley -

Yes, so using Sum of Grades in addition to those hidden items. Is there a way to change the aggregate using math to ... mimic a simple sum? 

This all started because we have 20 assignments that need to be worth 1.5 points, and since the dropdown menu won't allow for an assignment to be worth a decimal point, and there are instructors who would be overwhelmingly confused by doing math (making an assignment worth 15 points and dividing by 10), we opted to hide those assignments and create new gradebook items to keep a running total.

I'm now trying to brainstorm a workaround without a full overhaul since it's mid-semester.

In reply to Nic Ruley

Re: Grades in Graderview total correctly, but in User, things get wrong.

by Bob Puffer -

The problem with using a calculation is it cannot make allowance for ungraded items so you'd need to change the calc each time items get graded and then it would only work once all the students have been graded.

In reply to Nic Ruley

Re: Grades in Graderview total correctly, but in User, things get wrong.

by Kimberly Noseworthy -

Nic, I've been struggling with the gradebook for several of our faculty as well.  I've found the following:

If grade columns are created using the Add grade item option in simple or full view, totals will not always be correct.

If grades are entered in the columns created by the Add grade item option, the grades are marked as overridden and the totals will not be correct.  Although some student totals will be correct.  I can't figure this part of it out though. 

If a grade column uses a custom scale, then the aggregation cannot be sum of grades, it must be simple weighted mean of grades. 

I'm finding that many of the issues with the gradebook are resolved if the faculty would simply create gradebook columns by using the offline assignments (they can hide the link in the course modules if they don't want the students to see them).  And, if they post grades via the assignment and NOT in the gradebook. 

Now, if only I could turn off the Add grade item option, life would be much better. I've taken two of my major offenders and redone their gradebooks with assignments rather than items and haven't heard a peep from them since. 

 

 

In reply to Kimberly Noseworthy

Re: Grades in Graderview total correctly, but in User, things get wrong.

by Emma Richardson -
Picture of Documentation writers Picture of Particularly helpful Moodlers Picture of Plugin developers

I also fought with Grade Items for many years until it wassuggested that I remove the Add Grade Item button.  Very simple hack - just comment out the appropriate line in 

/grade/edit/tree/index.php

As to some of your comments above - of course the grade items will be marked overridden as it makes sense to add the grades in the grader report.  They are never calculated so what does it matter if they marked overridden?

Having grade items should not affect whether final grades are correct or not - you have something else going on there - probably an overridden final grade.

The worst issue with grade items is that they attach to the student and not to the course which creates all kinds of issue when backing and restoring.

My life has been so much simpler since I disabled the button!!