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Using Moodle course layout change

 
 
Picture of Helen Foster
Using Moodle course layout change
Group DevelopersGroup Documentation writersGroup Moodle HQGroup Particularly helpful MoodlersGroup Testers

Just to let you all know, we'll be changing the Using Moodle course layout to 'Show one section per page' very soon, and moving around and renaming some forums. For further details, please see MDLSITE-1888.

 
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Tim at Lone Pine Koala Sanctuary
Re: Using Moodle course layout change
Group DevelopersGroup Documentation writersGroup Particularly helpful Moodlers

Helen, I clicked on MDLSITE-1888, but I cannot see any information about what is going to be renamed to what, nor any arguments why 'one section per page' improves usability. (That will make things worse for me.)

 
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Tim at Lone Pine Koala Sanctuary
Re: Using Moodle course layout change
Group DevelopersGroup Documentation writersGroup Particularly helpful Moodlers

Ah, OK. burried in one comment is https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AmamVlPpCnn4dGtUY0ZTTkRYb2QxSS1EMnJPY3ZqbWc#gid=2. Is that the right document to look at?

If so, that looks like one huge "Plugins and other components" page, that is no better than what we have now (probably worse becase there are no sub-headings at all), and the a few other bits hidden on other 'show one section at a time' pages.

I also don't understand why 

are 'Getting started', but 

  • Comparisons and advocacy
  • Moodlemoots
  • Lounge

are 'Other stuff'.

 
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Picture of Visvanath Ratnaweera
Re: Using Moodle course layout change
Group Particularly helpful Moodlers
I thought we have a prototype, http://clone.moodle.org.

Are we talking about http://clone.moodle.org -> the mouse-over menu "Support" -> menu item "Forums"? But that points back to https://moodle.org/forums/, without clone! See also "Moodle.org 2013 re-design imminent" https://moodle.org/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=218895.
 
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Tim at Lone Pine Koala Sanctuary
Re: Using Moodle course layout change
Group DevelopersGroup Documentation writersGroup Particularly helpful Moodlers

We might be talking about http://clone.moodle.org/course/view.php?id=5.

That confirms my worst fears. It is bloody useless. Up to 6 mouse clicks to find a particular forum. I would much rather scroll.

 
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Picture of Visvanath Ratnaweera
Re: Using Moodle course layout change
Group Particularly helpful Moodlers
Helen

Could you pl. clarify: Do you expect all readers to do URL-guessing ( http://clone.moodle.org/course/view.php?id=5 ) or that page is not yet open for discussion as Maritn requested here https://moodle.org/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=218895#p954377 ?

Tim

About the number of clicks. I believe that is by design. The (powerful) majority of Moodlers fear SoD (scroll of death) but amazingly resistant to CoD (click of death). Therefore clicks don't count!

Thinkf of somebody looking for technical advice in German. Starting at http://moodle.org:
Click Target
-----------------
1. Community https://moodle.org/community/
2. List of all Courses (!) https://moodle.org/forums/
3. List of all Courses https://moodle.org/course/
4. Deutschsprachiges Moodle https://moodle.org/course/view.php?id=18
5. Hilfe und Diskussionen https://moodle.org/course/view.php?id=18&section=1
6. Moodle Technikforum https://moodle.org/mod/forum/view.php?id=949

I think the argument is that, today nobody navigates like this. They tell their wishes to the oracle and choose one from the top hits (no scrolling).
sad
 
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C'est moi :-)
Re: Using Moodle course layout change
Group Documentation writersGroup Particularly helpful MoodlersGroup TestersGroup Translators

Hi,

Perhaps i'm not like other people, but i'm not afraid at all of SoD (scroll of death), but i really don't like to do multiple clicks before going to the place i need !

SoD has it's pro (for the end user) :

  • you can see all that exists on one page
  • you can use mouse roll (or other scrolling method) to go fast to another place bottom (or up) on the page
  • you can search the page to find fast what you want
  • you can print the whole information in 1 time

What do you really gain removing SoD, and having content on several pages ?

  • the page is smaller

Yes, it's less server ressources used, but only in first time, because you then have to load the other parts you really want to see...

Séverin

 
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Picture of Helen Foster
Re: Using Moodle course layout change
Group DevelopersGroup Documentation writersGroup Moodle HQGroup Particularly helpful MoodlersGroup Testers

Thanks everyone for your feedback and apologies for things not being so clear in MDLSITE-1888.

Forums and course sections are listed here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AmamVlPpCnn4dGtUY0ZTTkRYb2QxSS1EMnJPY3ZqbWc#gid=2

Each section will have a summary describing what's inside, as in the Deutschsprachiges Moodle course.

Séverin, you're right that the scroll of death does have some advantages. If it seems that the one section per page course layout isn't working out, we can switch back, or perhaps make use of a new course format.

Also, don't worry, it won't look like the clone site! Up to now we've just used the clone site for testing various bits of code; it's not yet been set up with the new design. Apologies for running way behind the schedule announced by Martin. I'll post to let you all know when the site is ready for feedback.

One improvement I'm looking forward to being implemented is having forum posts rated as useful being displayed on the front page of moodle.org in a visitor's own language, together with a link to the community discussion course in that language. Thus, visitors should easily be able to find help in their own language, and not need to hunt through dropdown menus.

 
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Tim at Lone Pine Koala Sanctuary
Re: Using Moodle course layout change
Group DevelopersGroup Documentation writersGroup Particularly helpful Moodlers

I really don't see that as an improvement. If you don't like scroll of death (stupid term), well, you will still have it with the Plugins and other components, but then other bits are hidden.

I don't understand why you have banished Comparison & Advocacy to Other stuff, it is one of the more interesting forums. It belongs in getting started at least as much as teaching with Moodle and Partners.

Acutally, I would move everything from Other stuff to getting stared, except closed discussions, which you can hide at the bottom of the developers section, and you have a simpler structure.

If you are going to hide useful stuff behind unnecessary mouse clicks, then I think you have to split the monster section, which does split naturally into Activity modules and Other components.

 
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Picture of Helen Foster
Re: Using Moodle course layout change
Group DevelopersGroup Documentation writersGroup Moodle HQGroup Particularly helpful MoodlersGroup Testers

Tim, thanks for your suggestions. Can you think of a better name for the first section than 'Getting started'?

I agree that 'Plugins and other components' would split nicely into Activity modules and Other components, with the except of the Quiz activity forum which is also used for discussing question types, question import/ export formats and question behaviours.

 
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Tim at Lone Pine Koala Sanctuary
Re: Using Moodle course layout change
Group DevelopersGroup Documentation writersGroup Particularly helpful Moodlers

Welcome to Moodle? Gitting started is not that inappropriate a name. I suppose that the problem is it goes on being interesting and relevant even after you have started. However, the name is not 'Getting started then piss off'.

I would now worry about the fact that Quiz activity forum also covers Question* plugins. Of course, it also covers sub-plugins of activities like Assign, Book, ForumNG, Workshop, etc. While techinically the section name is inaccurate, I don't beleive anyone will acutally be confused by it. If peole are ever confused, then we can re-think.

Well, you could call it 'Activity modules and related components', or just put the related components bit in the section intro.

 
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