Is there a way to do this?

Is there a way to do this?

by Ian Hunt -
Number of replies: 7

I am hoping to create a quiz where students are required to deduce an answer (molecular structure) from information (spectra) supplied in the question. The answer is submitted in the form of a JME applet question (i.e. a drawn molecule).  Currently, students get a single random different version of the question from a pool. I'd like to be able to award part marks for the "evidence" that they correctly deduce en route. At present we use a short answer page that has to be graded manually (750 students = sad). 

i.e the quiz is 2 questions, one random question then a generic short answer box for their rationale.

In order to automate this to facilitate grading, I need to be able to specifically tie the "evidence" part marks questions to the same initial random question.  I had thought I could use a Cloze type format to do this but I don't think Cloze can support the JME qu subtype within.

Or I could create a a pool for each specific question, but then is there a way to get the students randomly assigned a specific pool ? (and hence all the related qu within ?

Hope that makes sense!

PS we currently run Moodle 2.0....

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In reply to Ian Hunt

Re: Is there a way to do this?

by Pierre Pichet -

I Ian,

You did not specify which kind of spectra ( IR, Raman, NMR).

Let's suppose it is IR. 

You could build a complex multichoice with multiple answers like.

There is a given band that allow to identify

  1. an alcohol
  2. a ketone

and so on.

Each good answer giving a related partial grade.

You can have perhaps more flexibilty with a multianswer containing different shortanswer or multiplechoice questions.

Pierre 

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In reply to Pierre Pichet

Re: Is there a way to do this?

by Ian Hunt -

The students actually get a set of 4 spectra: MS, IR, 13C and H NMR of a random structure.
I've already set up a multianswer (cloze) question that does what you suggest (plus some numerical such as mol. weight etc etc). The problem is that I had hoped that I could include the JME within the Cloze question for the "final" answer structure drawing (if that is right the student gets full marks). So my current problem is that I can't "match" the cloze qu to the realted JME qu.

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In reply to Ian Hunt

Re: Is there a way to do this?

by Jean-Michel Védrine -

Hello Iam,

Your problem is a very interesting one.

The most elegant way to solve it would be to allow multianswer to accept other question types.

This is the last unsolved bit of MDL-2727 wich bring me back a long time ago because I remember having asked Gustav Delius about this problem when Moodle was at version 1.5. By the way MDL-2727 is the oldest open  issue for the questions component in the tracker.

Unfortunately the solution is not easy as a lot of things about subquestions types are hardcoded in the multianswer code (even if I have the feeling that the situation is somewhat better with question engine 2), and for instance the way of parsing the question text would require carefull thinking.

Also it would be necessary to create the necessary methods a question type must have to be included in a multianswer one.

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In reply to Ian Hunt

Re: Is there a way to do this?

by Tim Hunt -
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Let's just make sure I understand the problem:

You have a quiz with two questions: JME (n variants) and essay.

When you go to the manual grading report, there is no easy way to grade all the essays for students who got variant 3 of question 1. Worse, when you are grading the essays, there is no way to see which variant of question 1 each student got.

You are correct about that.

So, your idea about specific pools is relevant. You could do it like this, although it would take quite a lot of set-up.

  1. Create one quiz for each variant of question 1.
  2. Make sure the admin settings 'Enable group members only' is (Under development -> experimental) turned on.
  3. In the course, create a group for each variant of question 1.
  4. Randomly allocate students to these groups.
  5. Put each group in a new grouping on its own.
  6. Edit the settings for each quiz, and make sure that each one is 'Available to group members only' and is set to use the corresponding grouping.
  7. Set up the grade-book to combine the scores from the separate quizzes into one column.

The docs at http://docs.moodle.org/20/en/Groupings should expand on what I have said above.

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In reply to Tim Hunt

Re: Is there a way to do this?

by Ian Hunt -

Yes your interpretation of the qu is correct.

Thanks for the grouping idea. I will have to consider that option. A complicating factor is that students get to pick the problem level: easy, medium and hard just before they write the quiz. So there are actually about 15 variants of the quiz and each student would have to be grouped into 3 (one at each level).

Since the JME qu is really a short answer question, is there a way to get it included as an allowed subtype of the Cloze ?

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In reply to Ian Hunt

Re: Is there a way to do this?

by Pierre Pichet -

I have not explore the JME but could you think of adding a JME question just to have access to the JME editor so that the student can copy and paste their SMILES code in a shortanswer included in the multianswer?

Pierre

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In reply to Pierre Pichet

Re: Is there a way to do this?

by Ian Hunt -

In principle that would be a work around.

The challenges I see are:

(1) The embedded qu and the JME qu would still not be linked
(2) The JME question would still require a right answer with score attached (could set qu = 0 value)
(3) I foresee students not remembering to do the cut and paste (they even forget to draw their answer before time runs out now.....)

However, as I type this, I'm thinking maybe you are right... but rather than running the JME qu as a separate existing Moodle qu type, I might be able the make the JME tool run within Cloze since I used to use it within short answer questions on our previous LMS.... You've inspired me to try that!

smile

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