Moodle in English: new host, help

new host, help

by adam penner - Sunday, March 4, 2012, 3:07 AM

HI, I am very frustrated with our current host, Remote-Learner. I've been with them for many, many years and all was good. I really appricated their support and help.

However in the recent history it has not been good. New rules and policys are poping up that I discover by accident. We can't do what we used to be able to do, and it keeps getting worse or I'm loosing confidence.

Long story short, we are losing SSH access. I need SSH access to make our scripts work. They give me no solution. Just too bad.

Because our site (pilottraining.ca) has so many paying customers I really want a mangaged or at least a semi managed hosting service with somebody who knows moodle. I have to have our scripts work (which pull data from google docs) We have about 1500 users and the site is 16gigs total.

Any suggestions? I am very willing to pay for reliablity and service. The site HAS to work ALL the time. I know enough to be dangerous, but I'm not a network pro. Another scenerio is to use a host like westhost, but I'm willing to pay for help with setting the server up and on going servce from somebody who is a Moodle/Network pro.

Adam

Re: new host, help

by Dan Marsden - Sunday, March 4, 2012, 12:25 PM

Hi Adam,

sorry to hear you've had trouble with RL - It sounds like your past history has been really good so I'd suggest you escalate the issue with them - it may be a communications break-down that can be easily resolved.

We are a Moodle Partner like Remote Learner and wouldn't usually give SSH access on our standard hosting packages but can offer a range of other packages (usually at a higher cost) which could include SSH access - RL may be able to upgrade your hosting package to a system that does allow you to continue with SSH access. If not, feel free to drop me a line and we can discuss further. I work for the Moodle Partner Catalyst IT and we have offices in the UK/NZ/AU - but also have hosting packages available from US based servers.

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Re: new host, help

by Visvanath Ratnaweera - Sunday, March 4, 2012, 3:20 PM

Hi

Do you mean you had SSH access upto now?

Are these scripts Unix (bash) shell scripts? Triggered by cron?

Who wrote/maintains those scripts?

Was the Moodle source modified/customized for you?

What are the non-core modules added/modified?

What is the Moodle version?

It is correct: Giving shell access to a shared server is a problem, because you can navigate into other peoples directories. But for a demanding site giving the customer full control by moving to a VPS/VDS or a dedicated server should be possible.

Talking of availability, there is nothing called "ALL the time". People agree on down time percentage. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_availability#Percentage_calculation.

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Re: new host, help

by adam penner - Tuesday, March 6, 2012, 2:22 AM

Do you mean you had SSH access up to now?

Yes, they want to move me to a new server that does not allow SSH access. This was not stated up front, and found out as we went along.

Are these scripts Unix (bash) shell scripts? Triggered by cron?

They are unix php scripts. Not triggered by chron on the server, they are triggered by a mac mini in my office that is running chron.

We have a system where the presentation files are uploaded to the server and converted from a google docs account and then syncs the presentations with the videos and makes mp3 automatically and then uploads the files to the server. It's a remarkable system and saves a lot of time and effort. It's been running for years. You can see the output by going to http://pilottraining.ca/ve_repo/html/p/Z29vZ2xlX2RvY3MvcHJlc2VudGF0aW9ucy9odG1sL0FaQlBtSzJlZHlwT1pIcDZjSFJrZDE4eE5EYzJZM1E1ZDJwMFpqVQ_e_e/page_1.html

Sftp won't work, says my techie guy. We are also using moodle authentication system where by only students logged into our moodle account can see the presentations/videos/mp3

Who wrote/maintains those scripts?

A techie friend of mine, i have copies of them all, he's still here to help.

Was the Moodle source modified/customized for you?

Moodle is not modified at all. It's "stock"

What are the non-core modules added/modified?

I believe it's all stock with whatever came with moodle. We are using a front end moveable type site and a ecommerence site store.pilottraining.ca

What is the Moodle version?

1.9.4

It is correct: Giving shell access to a shared server is a problem, because you can navigate into other peoples directories.

Is there not ways to turn that off?

But for a demanding site giving the customer full control by moving to a VPS/VDS or a dedicated server should be possible.

That's what I've had for years. I don't know why it's a concern now and not before. We've never given grief.

Talking of availability, there is nothing called "ALL the time". People agree on down time percentage. Seehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_availability#Percentage_calculation.

Yes, I understand.

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Re: new host, help

by Tim Hunt - Tuesday, March 6, 2012, 3:40 AM

It makes perfect sense to want to automate publishing content, and I cannot think of any way of doing that which fundamentally requires SSH access to the server.

If the scripts in question are already PHP scripts, then it should not be too hard to convert them into some sort of Local plugin that can be installed into Moodle and so all the work can be done on the server. If you were using Moodle 2.x I would suggest making a local plugin, but they did not exist in Moodle 1.9.x, so I would suggest making a block plugin, just because that is easy, and blocks can have cron scripts.

An alternative would be to keep most of the code running on your Mac mini, and have it finish by uploading the nicely formatted content to the SFTP account on the server. Then have the minimal amount of code necessary in Moodle to retrieve the files from the SFTP area and copy them to wherever they finally need to end up.

Without knowing more about what your scripts do, it is hard to offer more advice than this about how to do it.

Also, I have no idea what Remote Learner's (or other Moodle partners') Terms of Service say about running custom plugins on the server.

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Re: new host, help

by Dan Marsden - Tuesday, March 6, 2012, 4:00 AM

Speaking for Catalyst - we security review all code that is hosted on our servers - we do offer isolated VPS environments for clients that have more complex requirements but we'd probably prefer to work with you to convert your SSH scripts into something more manageable that didn't require ssh/root access to the server. Giving access like this can significantly increase the support we "might" need to provide as there would be potential for you to change all sorts of things on the server that could cause other issues. (increasing the hosting cost that would need to be charged)

in saying that - we wouldn't be interested in hosting a 1.9.4 site on our servers either - that Moodle version is full of security issues and we'd need to upgrade the site to the latest 1.9Stable.

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Re: new host, help

by Mike Churchward - Monday, March 5, 2012, 9:39 PM

Hi Adam -

Speaking for Remote-Learner, I am sorry that you are disapointed. Per our conversations over the last several weeks, we cannot provide SSH access to you. This is to protect the security and integrity of the servers. We have provided you with SFTP access, which would allow you to upload the files you need, and we have offerred to carry out any on-site shell activities you need for you.

If you would like us to discuss all of the terms of our service again, please contact me direct.

Mike

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Re: new host, help

by Pavel Gonzalez Garcia - Tuesday, March 6, 2012, 5:56 AM

hi Dear Adam

I hope that you are having a great day! If you are looking for a service provider, who I've had good experience with in the past; I would recommend At Home Education www.athomeeducation.com who has helped me in the past with some of my programs and hosting environment.

Warms regards, Pavel

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Re: new host, help

by Dan Marsden - Tuesday, March 6, 2012, 7:23 AM

interesting that you are listed as an "Executive" on the site... this smells a little like spam.... in your other posts you state "We are a US Company" - but in this one you state the company has helped you in the past? - could you please be a little more upfront about your association in your posts?

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Re: new host, help

by Pavel Gonzalez Garcia - Tuesday, March 6, 2012, 10:01 AM

sorry if you think what I'm spam. my life has just changed of state. The first time I was part of the company after I left and formed my own company in another country.
Is any problem with that? I can not suggest the services of any company?

Warms regards, Pavel

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Re: new host, help

by Derek Chirnside - Tuesday, March 6, 2012, 11:36 AM

Pavel, your message said "who has helped me in the past with some of my programs and hosting environment" which is like saying you were a "client" of AHE.

The AHE site actualy lists you as an executive "director of technology" of AHE.

This is usually regarded as being not good: to be unclear and not upfront about your involvements and connections with a company you promote.

This is what Dan is referring to.

-Derek

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Re: new host, help

by Visvanath Ratnaweera - Wednesday, March 7, 2012, 5:28 PM

Hope http://docs.moodle.org/22/en/Policy_on_Advertising answers your question.

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new host, help