Creating a new scale

Creating a new scale

by Nancy Gleaton -
Number of replies: 18

This is my first post to a Moodle forum, so please bear with me if I've put it my question in the wrong place. I'm still learning my way around!

I have a course that has activities (quizzes, projects with file submissons, etc.) that need to be graded on different scales. None are based on the the standard scale of 0-100. Some can earn as many as 350 point, others as few as 20 points.

When I create a new scale, do I have to input every possible numeric value? For example, the activites that can earn 350 points -- do I have to input 0,1,2,3... all the way up to 350? Are negative values allowed? In some cases, if a student does not turn in an assignment at all, I want to deduct points, so I need the option of giving a negative grade.

And when I go to create a new scale, every one defaults to a standard scale. The checkbox that indicates that is greyed out and cannot be changed. So how do I create a custom scale?

In reply to Nancy Gleaton

Re: Creating a new scale

by Maryel Mendiola -
Hi Nancy smile

Welcome to Using Moodle Forums


I recommend this documentation http://docs.moodle.org/en/Scales

There you can see many useful examples for you want

And No, you don't need to input complete scale from 0 to 350, don't worry wink



After you read Scale documentation and create your personal scales, tell us how you did it.




Have a nice day


In reply to Maryel Mendiola

Re: Creating a new scale

by Nancy Gleaton -

Hi Maryel,

Thie first thing I did was read the documentation, but it doesn't say a word about my two questions. The examples don't show how to enter the scale data. For example, if I don't need to enter every number between 0 and 350, what do I enter? The numbers won't be associated with a letter grade or a comment (as in 0-60=F or 0-60=Fail).

And it doesn't say anything about the default standard scale being checked and not being able to uncheck it, so I'm still clueless how to create a custom scale.

In reply to Nancy Gleaton

Re: Creating a new scale

by Itamar Tzadok -
In custom scales each item of the scale is 1 point and so max points is equal to the number of items in the scale. For example the scale 'good,very good, excellent' is equal to 1, 2 and 3 points respectively. That means, however, that for a complete custom scale 0-350 you need to enter all 351 numbers comma delimited. You can multiply and offset the grade by setting the multiplicator and offset in the grade item settings. So, if you you can work with ranges then a scale of 0-70 may be displayed as 0-350 in 5 points intervals by setting the multiplicator to 5.

For quizzes you should be able to set the max grade to any number you want in the edit questions form (not the quiz settings).

Hope this helps. smile
In reply to Itamar Tzadok

Re: Creating a new scale

by Nancy Gleaton -

Most certainly --- thanks! That made it a little more clear.

When I create the scale, it appears as a standard scale because it still won't let me uncheck the "standard scale" box when adding a scale. Is this okay? Will it still work? Is there some kind of setting somewhere that needs to be changed in order to create a custom scale? Or does it really matter in my case?

In reply to Nancy Gleaton

Re: Creating a new scale

by Nancy Gleaton -
Oh yeah, one more thing -- can I use negative numbers so that points are deducted?
In reply to Nancy Gleaton

Re: Creating a new scale

by Itamar Tzadok -
Negative numbers in activities and gradebook is currently an open issue and there's quite a bit of discussion but not too many effective solutions or workarounds. You can do some deduction of points by means of the gradebook formulas but even if it can be adjusted to the specifics of your grading model the formulas may still require a bit of juggling. If you provide more details about the context of the negative grades we can try to see if it is possible. You can also search 'negative' in the gradebook and quiz forums to see what has been already discussed.

You should be able to create either local (course level) or standard (site level) scales but that depends on your site settings (admin level). Are you the admin of your Moodle?

smile
In reply to Itamar Tzadok

Re: Creating a new scale

by Nancy Gleaton -

Yes, I am the admin.

All we need a negative value for is a point deduction if an assignment is not turned in. For example, on one worth 30 points, the student may get -10 for not turning in anything at all. Is there a way to do this (easily??) in the gradebook?

In reply to Nancy Gleaton

Re: Creating a new scale

by Itamar Tzadok -
This should be fairly easy provided that the grade of a submitted assignment is always greater than 0. Then, you can normalize the grade so as to obtain a flag for submission such that 1 is submitted and 0 is not submitted. You subtract 1 from the flag, multiply by 10 and add to the original grade. For submitted assignments the addition will be 0 and so the original grade will be preserved. However, for non-submitted assignments the addition will be -10 and since the original grade is already 0 the calculated grade will be -10.

The formula may look something like this:

=||assignment1||+((round((||assignment1||/100)+0.49,0)-1)*10)

With a grade of 25

=25+((round((25/100)+0.49,0)-1)*10)
=25+((round(0.74,0)-1)*10)
=25+((1-1)*10)
=25+0
=25

With non-submission

=0+((round((0/100)+0.49,0)-1)*10)
=0+((round(0.49,0)-1)*10)
=0+((0-1)*10)
=0+(-10)
=-10

Hope this helps. smile

In reply to Itamar Tzadok

Re: Creating a new scale

by Marius Pretorius -
Hello Itamar

Excuse my dumb question. I have seen you churn out these amazing formulas but have no idea how to apply them. Where would one enter these formulas?

Greetings
Marius
In reply to Marius Pretorius

Re: Creating a new scale

by Itamar Tzadok -
In the Gradebook, Categories and Items, there should be calc next to category-totals (when you add grade categorys), the course-total and any grade item you create directly in the Gradebook. The calc opens the 'edit calculation' form where you can add a formula. You don't have that option for activity-based grade items (grade items which are added automatically to the gradebook upon adding an activity to the course) but you can use the category/course totals or designated gradebook grade items to recalc any of the activity-based grades. smile
In reply to Itamar Tzadok

Re: Creating a new scale

by Marius Pretorius -
Wow! This has opened up a whole new dimension of the gradebook to me. Somehow, although I have been using the gradebook, this has passed me by. I am already impressed with the flexibility and useability of the gradebook ... and now all this extra power!

It will take me a while to grasp the full implication of this.

Greetings
Marius
In reply to Nancy Gleaton

Re: Creating a new scale

by Janet DiVincenzo -
Hi Nancy,

I am in the same boat you are -- I just want a raw numeric scale with a maximum of 150 points. I don't want to associate those points with categories, whereby 140-150 nets the student an "Excellent!"

So what is the workaround to avoid having to type in 0, 1, 2, 3,......150 in the custom scale box? I didn't understand the subsequent replies to your post.

Thanks,
Janet
In reply to Nancy Gleaton

Re: Creating a new scale

by Bob Puffer -
My very first hack on Moodle was to allow more points than 100 for assignments (quizzes already allow whatever). Most schools I know have performed this hack also -- its quite easy and well documented in the forums (I include it here only cuz forums are large and it may be difficult to find):

in lib/web.lib function print_grade_menu change the line "for ($i=100; $i>=1; $i--) {" to "for ($i=250; $i>=1; $i--) {"
in lib/form/modgrade.php function onQUickFormEvent change the line set "for ($i=100; $i>=1; $i--) {" to "for ($i=250; $i>=1; $i--) {"

After that you shouldn't need a scale, you can just use points. However... points are not really points in the core Moodle gradebook -- they're "real" numbers which are open to a variety of interpretations and IMO cause great confusion. The CLAMP LAE edition of Moodle will include a gradebook that allows points to be points under all circumstances. See this post here for more information.
In reply to Bob Puffer

Re: Creating a new scale

by Richard Webb -

I see that those two lines still exist in Moodle 2.3. Is this still the preferred method to fix this problem in Moodle 2.3? 

In reply to Nancy Gleaton

Re: Creating a new scale

by Dana Hursey -

I am in a similar situation.. I would like to create a scale that would grade each assignment on three criteria on a scale of 1-4. Is there a simple way to do this? Right now I do not see a way of using fractional numbers i.e. 3.67 which I would need if combining three numbers of different values.

In reply to Dana Hursey

Re: Creating a new scale

by Itamar Tzadok -

Each criterion is a whole number 1-4 and then average of the three criteria?

It shouldn't be too difficult to create the scale b/c all you need is something like

1,1.33,1.67,2,2.33,2.67,3,3.33,3.67,4

right?

If this grade is also used to calc the course grade and you're using the gradebook it may be a bit tricky b/c the gradebook will treat this scale as 1-10 (respectively).

Altenately, you can work with a scale of 1-12, such that the assignment grade is the sum of the criteria, and do the average in the gradebook by setting the multiplicator to 0.3333.

hth smile