Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Paul Vaughan -
Number of replies: 17
It was suggested somewhere in the docs that if you put something on the Tracker then you should try to gather support for it in the forums, so here's my two penne'th! (Link to tracker: http://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-15575)

I had an idea which I think would be reasonably simple to develop (tho beyond me as a n00b to Moodle coding), which was, on all blocks which are not already at the top or bottom of a page, to have 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons in the block's header. Sample examples:

example 2

That's it! Sometimes the little things can make a big difference.

I would also encourage everyone who has an interest in Moodle development to pop by the tracker and cast your vote for those bugs, improvements or new features which have been proposed but are not yet fixed/implemented.

Cheers. smile
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In reply to Paul Vaughan

Re: Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Anthony Borrow -
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Paul - This is an interesting suggestion that I'll keep an eye on. At the very least it would make a nice little patch if someone wants to work on it and upload the patch to the issue in the tracker. The concern with adding options is that it may increase the visual complexity of the page but even if it does not become something in core it could certainly be a nice patch for those who want it. Peace - Anthony
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In reply to Anthony Borrow

Re: Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Paul Vaughan -
Hi Antony. By patch, do you mean 'small snippet of code added to a core Moodle file', or something along those lines? I'm new enough not to properly know the terminology yet.
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In reply to Paul Vaughan

Re: Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Anthony Borrow -
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Paul - No worries, I continue to learn something everyday about Moodle. Yes you are right on the money, a patch or to be more precisely a diff file (which details the differences between two files - in this case the files that would need to be modified to get the functionality you are looking for and Moodle core files [core files being the unmodified code]) would be ideal. I will see if I can play with this idea and see what happens in terms of creating such a patch. Of course if someone else has already done this (i.e. implemented the top and bottom functionality) then all the better. Peace - Anthony
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In reply to Paul Vaughan

Re: Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Anthony Borrow -
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Paul - I started to play with this and visually have an initial draft although I have not tackled handling the actual moving behavior. In any case, I was just curious how folks felt the order of the icons should appear. Typically it looks like we have: left, up, down, right. Should we just add top and bottom to the right and have left, up, down, right, top, bottom or to left, up, top, down, bottom, right? Isn't this fun? Also, the buttons do not appear if the option is not available. So the left button disappears in the left most column since you could not move it. I wonder from a usability perspective if it might not be better to have the icon appear but be grayed out and non-functional. That way it would always appear the same and be in the same location or is it better just to hide the options that are not available? (By the way, what color should we paint the tool shed? wink Peace - Anthony


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In reply to Anthony Borrow

Re: Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Paul Vaughan -
Hi Antony, sorry about the delay. I personally think that the order should be top-to-bottom as it were:

[right], top, up, down, bottom, [left] (where appropriate)

Interesting usability angle: I notice that Moodle as it stands doesn't grey out (for example) the up button at the top, so incorporating this option into the 'top' and 'bottom' buttons only would be a headache? Having said that it might be something for the community consider as a larger concern (if they're not already, I haven't checked the tracker).

HEY EVERYBODY! What started as an idea has progressed to actual code. I would love everyone to think about the usefulness of this (as well as the usability angle Anthony mentions), mention it to your fellow Moodlers and VOTE for this idea on the tracker:

http://tracker.moodle.org/browse/MDL-15575

Thanks for your time and consideration!

Vaughany.
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In reply to Paul Vaughan

Re: Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Anthony Borrow -
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Paul,

Thanks for following up on this here in the forums. I think there are essentially two usability questions to ask.

The first being the question of the order of the icons and I think for the purpose of usability there needs to be a defined method to the madness that justifies why one solution is better than another (i.e. something besides I like the icons in this order). Perhaps Laia, who is working on a series of the usability issues can help research some of that and comment on it. I agree the icons should only appear when clicking on them is an option that will produce results.

The second issue is whether top and bottom are actually needed. While they do provide some convenience (of not having to manually move something up from the bottom of the list to the top one at a time, a similar type of behavior can be achieved using AJAX.

One caveat about the code. It is functional code but may still have some quirks as it has not been thoroughly tested. Comments and suggestions (and/or votes) on MDL-15575 are very much welcome.

Peace - Anthony
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In reply to Anthony Borrow

Re: Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Matt Campbell -
I would argue that while this could be done using AJAX, it will not necessarily be accessible - currently, AJAX requires javascript, and web content accessibility guidelines (guideline 6) state that the action should still function when javascript is disabled or not supported.

Reading the tracker, it sounds like this is only working correctly when AJAX is enabled anyway? I think it's worth figuring out so that it works whether or not AJAX is enabled.

Thanks,
Matt


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In reply to Matt Campbell

Re: Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Anthony Borrow -
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Matt - Sorry for not responding to your reply earlier. The moving blocks to top or bottom project got away from me once classes started. I'm pretty sure that I designed it to work without AJAX. An AJAX option would be nice too that did not require a page refresh. That would be a more complete solution that it works either way. Feel free to add that to the tracker as a suggestion for improving the patch. My intention was to provide the patch precisely as a patch for those who are interested. Being able to move the blocks with AJAX makes MDL-15575 less pressing as there is a way to do it for AJAX-enabled sites so it would just be a matter of convenience for other sites. I do not anticipate the patch working its way into core unless there is a great deal of interest in it from users because I believe the hope is to keep the user interface simple. But for those who want it and find it helpful, I am certainly happy to maintain it. I will give a little more time for folks to comment and/or vote on the issue and then I plan on moving MDL-15575 to CONTRIB and adding the code to the patches section. Peace - Anthony
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In reply to Anthony Borrow

Re: Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Paul Vaughan -
I've been using Moodle more and more recently, and the ability to reposition blocks is one thing which I find quite time consuming. Would it not be easier to tell a block which position you want it to be in once, with no more 'up', 'down' or even 'to top/bottom' clicks required?

The original idea was one which immediately sprang to mind, however there may be better options. I appreciate that the idea may have limited appeal and may make the blocks cluttered.

I like the way you can move an individual item anywhere else on the screen with just two clicks: one initiates the move process, and the 2nd (when the page has reloaded) puts the item back down. I would like to be able to do the same with blocks.

I'm now imagining a different system to the one I initially suggested. When in Edit mode, each block has a drop-down menu appear, with the block's position from the top listed in it. Changing a block's number moves that block to that position, and reorders the remaining blocks.

You could even include 1L, 2L, 3L, 1R, 2R, 3R to move the block's position top-to-bottom as well as left or right.

I have added this idea to the tracker with an appropriate screen-shot of roughly how it could work (taken from Blackboard but I'm sure you'll see what I mean).

Left pane: the 'before' shot.
Middle pane: drop the menu down and click on '1'
Right pane: the 'after' shot. Note the bottom option moved to the #1 position.
Attachment moving_items_Blackboard_.png
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In reply to Paul Vaughan

Re: Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Anthony Borrow -
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Paul - I commented in the tracker but figured I would also post here that I think functionally you can move blocks around with the AJAX functionality. I think that will meet the needs of most users without adding confusing to the user interface. Personally, I'm not a fan of the numbering approach as it is just one more thing to confuse the users because they will have to interpret (guess) what the numbers mean. It is not intuitive that it is for moving the block. AJAX gives you drag and drop functionality which most folks understand pretty well. Peace - Anthony
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In reply to Anthony Borrow

Re: Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Don Hinkelman -
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I agree with Anthony. AJAX (drag and drop) is the most intuitive way to move blocks around in Moodle. Is there some reason you do not like it or do not use it? It is a little buggy (sometimes it takes 2-3 tries to make a block move) but overall I like it. Don
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In reply to Don Hinkelman

Re: Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Pablo Cecere -
have anybody tried iGoogle.com?? i think that way of moving blocks is the best way to do it.
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In reply to Don Hinkelman

Re: Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Joseph Rézeau -
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I totally agree with Anthony and Don. The Ajax-powered drag & drop functionality is by far the most intuitive way to move things around. I wish it was possible to move all objects in moodle that way. May I add that I still do not understand why we should bother with Javascript not being enabled in users's browser. For some time now I have held the view that it does not make sense to believe that you can surf the Web without Javascript. [end rant mode]
Joseph
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In reply to Joseph Rézeau

Re: Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Nicolas Dunand -
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Joseph,

Why we should bother coping with non Javascript-enabled browsers ? For one, this goes agains the W3C accessibility guidelines : e.g. screen readers couldn't manae Javascript in any suitable way. So yes, some people actually have to (and thus must be able to) surf the Web without Javascript.

You could argue that usually most course editors wouldn't use screen readers, but in a general way it's always good practice to provide an alternative to Javascript.

Anyway, to answer Paul's initial proposal, most of our users would argue that the Moodle course editing interface is already having "too many buttons". Which I don't agree with, but adding more buttons (whose limited usefulness I could discuss) to the interface surely won't improve their experience.
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In reply to Anthony Borrow

Re: Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Anthony Borrow -
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OK - In the hopes of bringing some resolution to MDL-15575, I moved it to CONTRIB as CONTRIB-956 and treated the ability to add top and bottom buttons to the blocks as a patch. I have uploaded the code for the patch to CVS and created an entry in the Modules and Plugins database at http://moodle.org/mod/data/view.php?d=13&rid=2031. Let me know if you have any questions about how to make use of it for those who are interested. I will repeat that the preferred way of moving blocks in 1.9 and later is using AJAX which provides drag and drop like capabilities for moving the blocks; however, for those who find this non-AJAX way more convenient they are welcome to use the patch. Peace - Anthony
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In reply to Anthony Borrow

Re: Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Frankie Kam -
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This top-and-bottom patch is sheer genius!

I've just spent 60 minutes getting it installed (very slowly step-by-steo proceeded with extreme caution) on my production site and it WORKS A-OKAY!!

Very useful for me as I have given up on Ajax drag-and-drop, For some strange reason, Ajax movement doesn't stick for me. As soon as I click the "Turn Settings Off" button, the block that I moved with Ajax moved back to its original position. So very frustating!

Enter this patch. So I end up using the up and down arrows to move blocks in "slow motion" in the vertical direction....but this time, there's a big difference BECAUSE I can see and use the Top and Bottom icons! THEY WORK FOR ME!

Frankie Kam

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In reply to Frankie Kam

Re: Vote for new block idea: 'to top' and 'to bottom' buttons.

by Glenys Hanson -

Hi Frankie and everyone,

Ajax has had the problem you describe, but it seems to be working fine now on Moodle 1.9.10.

Cheers,

Glenys

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